From TT
J - reminds GM to please speak as loudly as possible, struggling to hear her
NC - email from JHurkiss to colleagues: ED was on board with my advice, impossible to keep them apart, advice was to suspend after discussion with GM. The real reason for the suspension was a need to protect DU from SP.
GM - I've said already it was about the risk assessment.
NC - what if SP raised again that DU was a man and shouldn't be in a woman only space.
GM - I wouldn't know, a convo between J Hurkiss and ED.
NC - before the break, you agreed, that patient safety allegations were raised because SP did not want DU in her CR.
GM - it came from the Datix
NC - the whole process was set off by the convo on Christmas Eve,
JR - my note doesn't say because of,
NC - I thought she did but we can check the transcript this evening
Fifer : that's the soond of the stenographer paying off
J - do you want to reframe the question
NC - the patient care allegations only arose after the Christmas Eve incident, it was prompted by the Christmas Eve allegation.
GM - the reporting in the Datix suggests that there were other concerns of Beth.
NC - SP has told DU that she does not want DU in her CR because he is a man, that is what gave rise to the allegations.
GM - DU raised a number of serious allegations
NC - but SP felt that she was harassed by DU in the CR, if she found his presence intimidating, she found his presence harassing - I'm no asking you to agree that it's true.
GM - yes, if thats how she felt
NC - there's no way that SP could have raised that with DU that would not have been discriminatory
GM - there's a way she could have raised it that would not have involved a confrontation
Fifer : wis there, aye
NC - there was no way to SP could have made that point to DU in the CR that wouldn't have been discriminatory,
GM - I can't answer that, I don't know about Beth's feelings
NC - how could she have raised it?
GM - through her line manager
NC - was there anyway that SP could have raised the issue with DU in the CR, that wasn't discriminatory
JR - this question has been asked and answered
NC - it has been asked but I think not answered
J (Big Sond) - it has, 'it depends on how it was asked, etc'.
Fifer : Big Sond weighs in. NC no bothert, dingys um again.
NC - let's go back and look at DU account , assume it is true
Fifer : that sarcasm was visible from Falkland Hill
J - checking with GM, have you seen this before clarifying what is relevant <all are reading now>
NC - assume everything is true, what's wrong with the manner in which C raised her concerns with DU
GM - it describes a difficult and escalating convo, compared to convicted rapist
NC - so if I ask you to pick out the worst thing, what is it
GM - she keeps telling Beth that she finds him intimidating and keeps repeating that
NC - so what was happening here was that SP was saying that sex matters in this situation, you may want to pretend you're a woman you are not a woman, and you are not a woman even if you call yourself one.
JR - that's not what the para says
NC - it's a fair precis,
<NC question, not GM answer> she says she feels intimidated, isn't it obvious that she doesn't want to get undressed in front of a man and she doesn't believe that DU is a woman.
GM - that's not what it says here
NC - it's perfectly obvious that she was objecting to a man in the woman's changing room.
GM - she was upset with DU being in the CR
NC - is there nothing in that statement that indicates that she was upset that a man was in the woman's changing room
GM - Beth "SP kept saying I was not a woman'
NC - doesn't that mean that he's a man
GM - some people have a gender id different from their sex, but there are biological men and women, so yes, I would agree
DR U AND ALL OF TRANS REDDIT TAKES IMMEDIATE SERIOUS EMOTIONAL DAMAGE AS GM ADMITS THE EXISTENCE OF MEN AND WOMAN
NC - and SP is saying that sex matters in this situation, this is the essence of her gender critical belief, that was the expression of her core gender critical belief.
GM - it might have been an expression of her core gender critical belief, but it was not appropriate to be confrontational about it
NC - there is no suggestion that she raised her voice or was aggressive,
GM - no
NC - so it follows that the suspension was because of her gender critical belief.
GM - the suspension was because of the risk assessment that was done
NC - so the entire suspension process was because of her GC belief
JR - a multi part question
NC - I thought we had agreed that SP was complaining about DU's presence.
GM - I don't know that.
NC - the process started because of SP complaining about DU in the CR
GM - the process was started because of the Datix that was generated
NC - it was SPs rejection of the harassment by DU that gave rise to the disc process
NC just dropping the ACME Anvil like it's nothing.
GM - it was the manner in which she went about raising the issue, Beth felt intimidated and harassed.
NC - I'm about to go on to another area of questioning, and conscious of the time.
NC flashes her briefcase open briefly while putting her parker pen away. It is bigger on the inside, and contains thousands of anvils.
J - lets break for lunch, back at 2 pm. Court rises
Fifer : <gestures Fife-ily> Fucks sake min, it's like a fuckin abbatoir. And that's only the forenane! We've got another sesh in the efternane yet. Gonnae need a bit more than a vileda fuckin supermop in here. Watch yer feet hen, I'm no even sure whit that puddle is.