Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 14

[ickky]

The Tribunal started on 25th April at 10am. If you would like to view online you need to send a request for access as early as possible.

Send an email to

[email protected]

The subject heading of the email request should read

“MEDIA OR PUBLIC ACCESS REQUEST – Case number 2202172/2020 - Ms A Bailey – 25th April 2022.

Then ask for the pin for the online access.

You will be contacted with instructions on how to observe the hearing.

When joining the live tribunal please choose a non inflammatory/offensive name, everyone can see it in the chat - This is a court room, please behave accordingly.

The court chat function is there for official court purposes, not for observers, please don't use it unless you have a technical issue.

On the first page underneath where you put your screen name, select the video and mic that are not crossed out (top option), this is the courts vid and mic.
On the next page select NONE on the drop down windows for vid and mic, these are your own video and mic.

You must be muted so as to not disturb the hearing.

There is also live tweeting from

twitter.com/tribunaltweets

Abbreviations:

AB: Allison Bailey, claimant
BC: Ben Cooper QC, barrister for AB
SW = Stonewall Equality Limited (respondent 1)
IO = Ijeoma Omambala QC, senior counsel - barrister for SW
RW = Robin White junior counsel to SW - assisting IO
GC = Garden Court Chambers Limited (respondent 2) (GCC would be a better abbreviation)
AH = Andrew Hochhauser QC, senior counsel - barrister for GC
JR = Jane Russell junior counsel to GC - assisting AH
RM= Rajiv Menon QC & SH = Stephanie Harrison QC (jointly respondent 3 along with all members of GC except AB)
EJ = Employment Judge Goodman hearing the case
Panel = any one of the three panel members (EJ and two lay members)

Thread 1 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4529887-Allison-Bailey-v-Stonewall-Employment-Tribunal-hearing?

Thread 2 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4542466-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-2

Thread 3 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4545725-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-3

Thread 4 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4546945-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-4

Thread 5 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4548160-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-5

Thread 6 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4550451-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-6

Thread 7 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4551757-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-7

Thread 8 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4552521-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-8

Thread 9 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553181-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-9

Thread 10 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553754-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-10

Thread 11 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555145-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-11

Thread 12 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555687-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-12

Thread 13 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556235-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-13

Allison Bailey - claimant (4-9, 11-13 May)

Witnesses for the claimant:

Dr Nicola Williams - Fair Play for Women (29 April)
Dr Judith Green - A Woman's Place (29 April)
Kate Barker - LGB Alliance (3 May)
Lisa-Marie Taylor - FiLiA (4 May)

Witnesses for the respondents:

Stephen Lue - barrister for GCC (3-4 May)
Zainab Al-Farabi - ex Stonewall (10 May)
Kirrin Medcalf - head of trans inclusion Stonewall (10 May)
Leslie Thomas - barrister at GCC (13 May)
Sanjay Sood Smith - Stonewall (16 May)
Shaan Knan - LGBT consortium - on STAG (16 May)
Rajiv Menon - joint head of chambers (16-17 May)
Maya Sikand - barrister at GCC (17-18 May)
Mia Hakl-Law - HR senior for GCC (18 May)
Judy Khan - barrister at GCC (19-20 May)
Charlie Tennent - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Luke Harvey - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Louise Hooper - Barrister at GCC (20 May)
Marc Willers - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Stephen Clark - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Liz Davies - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Katherine McGahy - Bar Council Ethics Committee's VC (24 May)
Tom Wainwright - Barrister at GCC (24 May)
Colin Cook - clerk at GCC (24 May
David Renton - barrister at GCC (20 May, to concluded on 25th May)
David de Menezes - GCC, Head of Marketing
Kathryn Cronin - barrister at GCC

To come:

Michelle Brewer - barrister at GCC at time, now left and a judge.
Stephanie Harrison - joint head of chambers

Thanks - again! - @ickky for yet another new thread

Garden Court Chambers, motto: currere et abscondere

Wandering around singing to myself that Edwin Starr song, what is it good for... absolutely nothing

Can't think why. Earworm.

Does anyone know if the tribunal will find in AB’s favour if they are not convinced the HoC and rest of GCC adopted a view that was hostile in and of itself to her views, but rather were hostile to the idea of dealing with the expected fall-out from her views? If they’re convinced she was treated the way she was when someone with a different view (say, the Zionist complaint that was made) would have been treated more fairly? If their position wasn’t ideological but pragmatic (because they assumed a risk of reputational damage that wasn’t actually there), would she still win?

There were so many holes in today’s testimonies that it was infuriating to listen to. For example,

The small number of tweets received by GCC following AB’s LGB launch tweet was a Twitter storm, which posed a reputational risk and prompted analysis of the number of ‘some’ of the followers of those tweeters (which DMM thinks prove credibility), internal email discussions on how to respond followed by announcing that AB is being investigated but the responses/questions in support of AB received by GCC and criticising GCC in response to the announcement of the investigation, which BC discussed with DMM today, presumably also raised a potential reputational risk yet prompted .. nothing.

When asked by BC how such a small number of tweets could be a Twitter storm which prompted these actions, DMM said he also considered the responses received directly by AB. Yet he also testified that he had only given these a quick scan and somehow failed to notice the abundance of tweets of abuse, death threats etc.

How DMM, as the person with overall responsibility for the GCC Twitter account, can say with a straight face that he didn’t know that tagging someone in a tweet means the tweet will appear in that person’s feed is beyond me. Nor that tweets sent out or retweeted by GCC on its account (describing articles promoting self id as a ‘must read’ for example) are not the views of GCC. It’s a corporate social media account!!

And KC not understanding the basics of GDPR, even though she proudly announced that she went back before giving testimony to refresh her memory of the rules, is astounding for a barrister.

Time for support wine. Big hugs Allison.

@SpindleInTheWind had to check an online translator....love it!!

@SpindleInTheWind also...I notice you have returned the support cat. Was she not to your liking? I can send an alternative. I'll need five minutes to catch one first though.

Does anyone know why Alex Sharpe has not been called as a witness?

@tabbycatstripy
"If their position wasn’t ideological but pragmatic (because they assumed a risk of reputational damage that wasn’t actually there), would she still win?"

Surely it shouldn't matter why they did what they did it the outcome was still that she was discriminated against due to the protected act. wether ideology of pragmatism the effect on Allison was the same?

@tabbycatstripy or I could be talking out my rear end!

Thanks yet again ickky et al

I simultaneously desperately want to come to the film premiere meet up and know I’d feel out classed. Thanks to all keeping us informed, educated 😉and laughing on these threads.

I kept wondering what CM woke up and thought this morning.

I can't keep the juxtaposition of her little smiles as she lectured and the corresponding reactions of twitter users as her offensive comparisons kept rolling in.

I'm afraid that Cattus Auxilium like neither my baked beans on sourdough lunch or my wittering on in shockingly bad latin. I think it was expecting some magick spells to follow and scarpered.

@Hazycoffeek as awful as today was it did seem that today's witnesses aren't so bothered about trying to emphasise how no-one gossiped ? They did seem more open to admitting that basically people were really pissed off with her. I mean that may not have been their intention but that was how it seemed to come across to me.

And DDM did swing between I couldn't possibly have read 800 comments and i checked out his 1000 followers!

‘Surely it shouldn't matter why they did what they did it the outcome was still that she was discriminated against due to the protected act. wether ideology of pragmatism the effect on Allison was the same?’

I hope that’s right. I think it reflects what happened. Some of them assumed her beliefs were driven hatred or bigotry, others just didn’t want to put in the effort it would have taken to stand up for what was right. But for another belief system (climate change, socialism, whatever) they would have reacted completely differently.

@SpindleInTheWind I can send the senior cat. He's fluent in Latin, and likes baked beans (that may be because in our butter in mine though.

He'll need a bath and his own room when he gets there. 😼

I put butter!

DdeM's evidence today was an absolute mess. He may well have Uncle Colm-ed everyone to the verge of tears, but Ben Cooper QC drew some valuable contradictions out of him, which casts doubt not just on the credbility of that individual witness but on the overall narrative being supplied by GCC. (I think.)

Very good work from BC.

This tribunal hearing might have solved one of GCC's major problems though - they are all likely to be rather less busy in future.

🤣🤣🤣

@BenCoopersSupportWren I've found your outfit for the film/mini series

We shall have such adventures together

@Boiledbeetle , thanks and you’re right. I just hope that the tribunal members can see past the mechanics of how to use Twitter and see the appalling treatment of AB.

You’re hired as Head of Costuming 😁