Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 10

[ickky]

The Tribunal started on 25th April at 10am. If you would like to view online you need to send a request for access as early as possible.

Send an email to

[email protected]

The subject heading of the email request should read

“MEDIA OR PUBLIC ACCESS REQUEST – Case number 2202172/2020 - Ms A Bailey – 25th April 2022.

Then ask for the pin for the online access.

You will be contacted with instructions on how to observe the hearing.

When joining the live tribunal please choose a non inflammatory/offensive name, everyone can see it in the chat - This is a court room, please behave accordingly.

The court chat function is there for official court purposes, not for observers, please don't use it unless you have a technical issue.

On the first page underneath where you put your screen name, select the video and mic that are not crossed out (top option), this is the courts vid and mic.
On the next page select NONE on the drop down windows for vid and mic, these are your own video and mic.

You must be muted so as to not disturb the hearing.

There is also live tweeting from

twitter.com/tribunaltweets

Abbreviations:

AB: Allison Bailey, claimant
BC: Ben Cooper QC, barrister for AB
SW = Stonewall Equality Limited (respondent 1)
IO = Ijeoma Omambala QC, senior counsel - barrister for SW
RW = Robin White junior counsel to SW - assisting IO
GC = Garden Court Chambers Limited (respondent 2) (GCC would be a better abbreviation)
AH = Andrew Hochhauser QC, senior counsel - barrister for GC
JR = Jane Russell junior counsel to GC - assisting AH
RM= Rajiv Menon QC & SH = Stephanie Harrison QC (jointly respondent 3 along with all members of GC except AB)
EJ = Employment Judge Goodman hearing the case
Panel = any one of the three panel members (EJ and two lay members)

Thread 1 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4529887-Allison-Bailey-v-Stonewall-Employment-Tribunal-hearing?

Thread 2 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4542466-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-2

Thread 3 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4545725-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-3

Thread 4 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4546945-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-4

Thread 5 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4548160-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-5

Thread 6 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4550451-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-6

Thread 7 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4551757-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-7

Thread 8 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4552521-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-8

Thread 9 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553181-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-9


Allison Bailey - claimant (4-9, 11-13 May)

Witnesses for the claimant:

Dr Nicola Williams - Fair Play for Women (29 April)
Dr Judith Green - A Woman's Place (29 April)
Kate Barker - LGB Alliance (3 May)
Lisa-Marie Taylor - FiLiA (4 May)

Witnesses for the respondents:

Stephen Lue - barrister for GCC (3-4 May)
Zainab Al-Farabi - ex Stonewall (10 May)
Kirrin Medcalf - head of trans inclusion Stonewall (10 May)
Leslie Thomas - barrister at GCC (13 May)
Sanjay Sood Smith - Stonewall (16 May)
Shaan Knan - LGBT consortium - on STAG (16 May)
Rajiv Menon - joint head of chambers (16-17 May)
Maya Sikand - barrister at GCC (17-18 May)
Mia Hakl-Law - HR senior for GCC (18 May)
Judy Khan - barrister at GCC (19-20 May)
Charlie Tennent - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Luke Harvey - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Louise Hooper - Barrister at GCC (20 May)

To come?
David Renton - barrister at GCC (20 May, to continue on 25th May)
Stephanie Harrison - joint head of chambers
Michelle Brewer - barrister at GCC at time, now left and a judge.
David de Menezes - GCC, Head of Marketing

[QuetzalTerfLus]

Just dipping in to say thank you to @ickky and all others who contribute to these threads - it is all so interesting and important. And funny! I want a support mealworm / wren / multiple support Twixes.

I even quite enjoy the admonishments. Anyone who parents teens must surely find the insult “you are soooo embarrassing” to be a badge of honour?!

[DifficultBloodyWoman]

I came here for the legal stuff, I stayed here for the emotional support twixes.

[VestofAbsurdity]

Just checking in, notable in the DR blog how quickly they refuse to discuss any more and stomp off when they cannot counter the arguments put forward. That a Barrister who should be able to argue and set out their case coherently does this shows just how much GI requires complete removal of critical and logical thinking and the light it shines on the inherent misogyny throughout this, women are not considered worthy of the basics of privacy and dignity let alone anything else.

[Humbold]

Just wanted to say thanks and reinforce some earlier comments about the excellent job everyone is doing on here. I'm not expecting anyone to do more than they're doing at the moment. Please don't feel the need to apologize for not contextualising each and every comment and exclamation you're making. It would take you far too long and also risk contravening the rule about reporting. I switch between here and the Twitter thread especially if I think I've missed a crucial comment - it works out fine.

I haven't logged on to watch because when I did that with Maya I constantly worried about leaving my camera or mic on and my paranoia couldn't take it! I admire all your perseverance with the appalling tech issues too - I can't imagine how annoying those are to Allison and her team. Hope she and Ben get some rest over the weekend. It must be very hard to 'switch off'.

[theemperorhasnoclothes]

@QuetzalTerfLus

Just dipping in to say thank you to @ickky and all others who contribute to these threads - it is all so interesting and important. And funny! I want a support mealworm / wren / multiple support Twixes.

I even quite enjoy the admonishments. Anyone who parents teens must surely find the insult “you are soooo embarrassing” to be a badge of honour?!

I'd also like to thank @ickky

I want to question the wisdom of having a support mealworm AND a support wren in the same room though. It could get ugly. Unless the mealworm is the support for the wren, in which case that's fine.

[SallyLockheart]

Been following. Many thanks for running commentary and extra info. And pictures of BCQC😀 - he never seems to get rattled, does he?

[Bowednotbroken]

Long-time lurker on all these threads popping my head up to thank you all for comments and commentary, it is appreciated. Yes the 'oh wow' remarks make me wonder what I've missed but it's my problem not yours! Please don't stop responding in the moment - it's part of what makes these such a fascinating read.

[Mumsnut]

On the back of this tribunal, I'm finding myself more and more and impatient for the Maya verdict

[Eddielizzard]

When is the Maya verdict due?

[WhatALoadOfHorseBundle]

Yes please don't lose the spontaneous posting!! It adds to the atmosphere and we can always catch up with the details afterwards

[Helleofabore]

Thank you ickky!!

[Furries]

Just to reiterate, I’m very thankful for these threads. And I’m loving the social interaction side of them, have had numerous laughs when catching up on them.

Huge apologies for causing any offence with my comment on the previous thread. I definitely am not expecting journalist-level reporting or verbatim transcripts. I really only meant the odd “wow” comment or question being given context. But, as others have pointed out, it’s my problem that I’m not able to follow it live.

Am leaving some virtual multi-packs of Twixes by way of an apology!

[nauticant]

There's an assumption on these threads that DR made an electronic recording of AB's speaking in her telephone call. This does not appear to be correct. If you refer to AB's witness statement she says:

(443) In the Bundle, there is also a note apparently written by David Renton recording a conversation with me (Bundle Page 3626). I think it is extremely odd that my roommate would make an attendance note of a conversation in this way.

allisonbailey.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/Witness-Statement-of-Allison-Bailey.pdf

DR might behave a bit like a Stasi informer (thanks Justice Knowles!) but it's important to get this right.

[IamEarthymama]

Another thread follower who wants to say Thank you to ickky for all the threads and also a huge bunch of ‘thank you’s to everyone who comments and contributes with such knowledge and understanding of the tribunal process.

I am in awe of the FWR posters on MN everyday but this level of insight and the willingness to share said insight makes me so glad to be one of the Vipers. This is an invaluable space for those fighting for Women’s Rights in the C21st.

I do so hope we can have a meet up one day, can you imagine? A host of women together, sharing their experiences and knowledge, but in the flesh! With tea and gin and pints and cake and crisps!

[nauticant]

Also thanks@ickkyfor the new thread. Yet again.

No worries @Furries. I wanted to harrumph at your post but then could see it was a gentle request to add more context where we can. Which is perfectly reasonable.

[tabbycatstripy]

Yes, it’s not illegal to write down what someone says. It’s a gross breach of professional etiquette given that AB’s beliefs are in fact protected (and entirely ordinary) but he was entitled to do it in theory. The issue is whether it contributes to her case that Chambers was effectively hostile to her as a corporate entity.

[Clangyleg]

Ok I misinterpreted the meaning of recorded…in my head it was like a reel to reel kind of device. Got it wrong.

[Ereshkigalangcleg]

Just checking in, notable in the DR blog how quickly they refuse to discuss any more and stomp off when they cannot counter the arguments put forward.

I agree. He stops replying.

[GrumpyMenopausalWombWielder]

I didn't know this was here & posted in old thread asking for it. 🤦🏻‍♀️

Thanks ickky 🙏

[EmpressaurusWitchDoesntBurn]

Thanks for the new thread!

[VestofAbsurdity]

I agree. He stops replying.

They always do, Eresh, normally it is preceded by insults and threats but I would imagine DR engaged his Barrister brain and refrained.

[Clymene]

Thanks for new thread @ickky!

[DoctorTwo]

Thank you @ickky for the new thread, I truly hope Allison wins. Can't offer a support twix, but I do have an emotional support weeble. It's wobbling a bit.

[tedgran]

Yes, thanks to all who have posted on this and the Maya thread, so enlightening. My DGD1 is doing history of art at university and told me that her feedback on the gender part of the course was"waste of time/not relevant!"

[SpindleInTheWind]

Interesting that DR believes that the Judge in the Forstater appeal got it wrong. (See: his blog piece.)

Yeah, I mean, what the fuck would Sir Akhlaq Ur-Rahman Choudhury the President of the Employment Appeal Tribunal and a Hight Court Judge know, eh?