Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 15

[ickky]

The Tribunal started on 25th April at 10am. If you would like to view online you need to send a request for access as early as possible.

Send an email to

[email protected]

The subject heading of the email request should read

“MEDIA OR PUBLIC ACCESS REQUEST – Case number 2202172/2020 - Ms A Bailey – 25th April 2022.

Then ask for the pin for the online access.

You will be contacted with instructions on how to observe the hearing.

When joining the live tribunal please choose a non inflammatory/offensive name, everyone can see it in the chat - This is a court room, please behave accordingly.

The court chat function is there for official court purposes, not for observers, please don't use it unless you have a technical issue.

On the first page underneath where you put your screen name, select the video and mic that are not crossed out (top option), this is the courts vid and mic.
On the next page select NONE on the drop down windows for vid and mic, these are your own video and mic.

You must be muted so as to not disturb the hearing.

There is also live tweeting from

twitter.com/tribunaltweets

Abbreviations:

AB: Allison Bailey, claimant
BC: Ben Cooper QC, barrister for AB
SW = Stonewall Equality Limited (respondent 1)
IO = Ijeoma Omambala QC, senior counsel - barrister for SW
RW = Robin White junior counsel to SW - assisting IO
GC = Garden Court Chambers Limited (respondent 2) (GCC would be a better abbreviation)
AH = Andrew Hochhause

r QC, senior counsel - barrister for GC (teehee)
JR = Jane Russell junior counsel to GC - assisting AH
RM= Rajiv Menon QC & SH = Stephanie Harrison QC (jointly respondent 3 along with all members of GC except AB)
EJ = Employment Judge Goodman hearing the case
Panel = any one of the three panel members (EJ and two lay members)

Thread 1 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4529887-Allison-Bailey-v-Stonewall-Employment-Tribunal-hearing?

Thread 2 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4542466-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-2

Thread 3 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4545725-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-3

Thread 4 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4546945-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-4

Thread 5 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4548160-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-5

Thread 6 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4550451-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-6

Thread 7 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4551757-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-7

Thread 8 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4552521-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-8

Thread 9 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553181-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-9

Thread 10 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553754-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-10

Thread 11 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555145-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-11

Thread 12 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555687-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-12

Thread 13 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556235-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-13

Thread 14 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556407-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-14

Allison Bailey - claimant (4-9, 11-13 May)

Witnesses for the claimant:

Dr Nicola Williams - Fair Play for Women (29 April)
Dr Judith Green - A Woman's Place (29 April)
Kate Barker - LGB Alliance (3 May)
Lisa-Marie Taylor - FiLiA (4 May)

Witnesses for the respondents:

Stephen Lue - barrister for GCC (3-4 May)
Zainab Al-Farabi - ex Stonewall (10 May)
Kirrin Medcalf - head of trans inclusion Stonewall (10 May)
Leslie Thomas - barrister at GCC (13 May)
Sanjay Sood Smith - Stonewall (16 May)
Shaan Knan - LGBT consortium - on STAG (16 May)
Rajiv Menon - joint head of chambers (16-17 May)
Maya Sikand - barrister at GCC (17-18 May)
Mia Hakl-Law - HR senior for GCC (18 May)
Judy Khan - barrister at GCC (19-20 May)
Charlie Tennent - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Luke Harvey - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Louise Hooper - Barrister at GCC (20 May)
David Renton - barrister at GCC (20 May, 25 May)
Marc Willers - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Stephen Clark - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Liz Davies - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Cathryn McGahey - Bar Council Ethics Committee's VC (24 May)
Tom Wainwright - Barrister at GCC (24 May)
Colin Cook - Head clerk at GCC (24 May)
David de Menezes - GCC, Head of Marketing (25 May)
Kathryn Cronin - barrister at GCC (25 May)
Michelle Brewer - barrister at GCC at time, now left and a judge (26 May)
Stephanie Harrison - joint head of chambers (26 May)

To come:

MB is playing the tribunal version of that game where you have to talk for as long as you can about a subject without actually mentioning the subject; talk around the question without answering the question.

Body language - hands over the mouth a lot more now

And well done @katmarie

If EJ's schedule is going to be adhered to, BC has gone through 2 hours 36 minutes and has 24 minutes left.

Someone asked about traumatised female asylum seekers. Very interestingly, according to statistics here:
www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-statistics-year-ending-june-2020/how-many-people-do-we-grant-asylum-or-protection-to

male asylum seekers vastly outnumber female asylum seekers. So, sadly, in terms of 'clients of immigration barristers' they are much more likely to be male.

She's so irritating, why does she make a big song and dance every time she has to find a page 'just let me find it, bla bla bla' . Just shut up and do it!!

MB still waffle waffle waffle waffle

Going back a bit, but my impression has been that whenever BC asks MB if she understands that these are AB’s views that she’s entitled to hold and express, rather than answering, MB goes off into an attack on those views, pretty much saying they’re indefensible.

She must have been so devastated by the appeal ruling in Maya’s case.

Again not remembering anything that doesn't suit her

Phew! Finally caught up.

Random thoughts from the last thread -

I too had to look up homophily

I simply don't believe that 'Get the L Out' shouted 'transpersons are rapists'.

It's transphobic to make the choice to leave a marriage if your spouse has transitioned? Seriously?

The comments from here which made me laugh were chinny reckon and the interrupting barrister joke.

With mandatory repetition, deviation and hesitation.

Is the tribunal able to draw inferences from waffling and time-wasting on an epic scale?

God, this is excruciating

I feel like BC is doing the ‘give them enough rope’

her rambling and turning all statements into focussing on TW shows she’s not capable of looking from a neutral standpoint

I feel like he's still got quite a bit of ground to cover (mainly due to excessive waffling) - do you think he'll just run on and allow time for cross before lunch and then start SH this afternoon?

If you're asked "Did you do something?" saying "Why would I?" isn't exactly "no".

this part of the film/mini series will have soooo many cutaway scenes to us just all going fuck this and sitting back looking absolutely done.

for those not watching live and catching up later. it is literally waffle waffle waffle waffle waffle waffle waffle zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Thank you.

Maybe finally on thread 16 we will have it all right with names spelt correctly and everything😂.

She keeps answering his question with "why would I do that" rather than saying "no". Is this a question avoiding tactic?

Place marking x

She's so irritating, why does she make a big song and dance every time she has to find a page 'just let me find it, bla bla bla' . Just shut up and do it!!

To waste time and distract, I imagine.

MB not happy that she is being nailed to the wall. So she can't remember to anything.

Body language - hands over the mouth a lot more now

YY.

The fog of amnesia is falling all around MB.

i thought no one could top DDM for the ability to cure insomnia, but fuck me!

She's also starting to stutter a little.