Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 15

[ickky]

The Tribunal started on 25th April at 10am. If you would like to view online you need to send a request for access as early as possible.

Send an email to

[email protected]

The subject heading of the email request should read

“MEDIA OR PUBLIC ACCESS REQUEST – Case number 2202172/2020 - Ms A Bailey – 25th April 2022.

Then ask for the pin for the online access.

You will be contacted with instructions on how to observe the hearing.

When joining the live tribunal please choose a non inflammatory/offensive name, everyone can see it in the chat - This is a court room, please behave accordingly.

The court chat function is there for official court purposes, not for observers, please don't use it unless you have a technical issue.

On the first page underneath where you put your screen name, select the video and mic that are not crossed out (top option), this is the courts vid and mic.
On the next page select NONE on the drop down windows for vid and mic, these are your own video and mic.

You must be muted so as to not disturb the hearing.

There is also live tweeting from

twitter.com/tribunaltweets

Abbreviations:

AB: Allison Bailey, claimant
BC: Ben Cooper QC, barrister for AB
SW = Stonewall Equality Limited (respondent 1)
IO = Ijeoma Omambala QC, senior counsel - barrister for SW
RW = Robin White junior counsel to SW - assisting IO
GC = Garden Court Chambers Limited (respondent 2) (GCC would be a better abbreviation)
AH = Andrew Hochhause

r QC, senior counsel - barrister for GC (teehee)
JR = Jane Russell junior counsel to GC - assisting AH
RM= Rajiv Menon QC & SH = Stephanie Harrison QC (jointly respondent 3 along with all members of GC except AB)
EJ = Employment Judge Goodman hearing the case
Panel = any one of the three panel members (EJ and two lay members)

Thread 1 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4529887-Allison-Bailey-v-Stonewall-Employment-Tribunal-hearing?

Thread 2 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4542466-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-2

Thread 3 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4545725-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-3

Thread 4 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4546945-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-4

Thread 5 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4548160-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-5

Thread 6 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4550451-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-6

Thread 7 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4551757-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-7

Thread 8 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4552521-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-8

Thread 9 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553181-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-9

Thread 10 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553754-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-10

Thread 11 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555145-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-11

Thread 12 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555687-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-12

Thread 13 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556235-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-13

Thread 14 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556407-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-14

Allison Bailey - claimant (4-9, 11-13 May)

Witnesses for the claimant:

Dr Nicola Williams - Fair Play for Women (29 April)
Dr Judith Green - A Woman's Place (29 April)
Kate Barker - LGB Alliance (3 May)
Lisa-Marie Taylor - FiLiA (4 May)

Witnesses for the respondents:

Stephen Lue - barrister for GCC (3-4 May)
Zainab Al-Farabi - ex Stonewall (10 May)
Kirrin Medcalf - head of trans inclusion Stonewall (10 May)
Leslie Thomas - barrister at GCC (13 May)
Sanjay Sood Smith - Stonewall (16 May)
Shaan Knan - LGBT consortium - on STAG (16 May)
Rajiv Menon - joint head of chambers (16-17 May)
Maya Sikand - barrister at GCC (17-18 May)
Mia Hakl-Law - HR senior for GCC (18 May)
Judy Khan - barrister at GCC (19-20 May)
Charlie Tennent - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Luke Harvey - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Louise Hooper - Barrister at GCC (20 May)
David Renton - barrister at GCC (20 May, 25 May)
Marc Willers - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Stephen Clark - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Liz Davies - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Cathryn McGahey - Bar Council Ethics Committee's VC (24 May)
Tom Wainwright - Barrister at GCC (24 May)
Colin Cook - Head clerk at GCC (24 May)
David de Menezes - GCC, Head of Marketing (25 May)
Kathryn Cronin - barrister at GCC (25 May)
Michelle Brewer - barrister at GCC at time, now left and a judge (26 May)
Stephanie Harrison - joint head of chambers (26 May)

To come:

Male bodied person is the same to a transwomen as terf is to GCF's

If a conversation requires a fair bit of concentration (eg your kids are too distracting for you to speak properly) then you shouldn't be having that phone call while driving. To be having a serious and difficult phone consultation, dealing with distracting children then frankly you are driving without due care and attention.

TERF is as derogatory as male bodied person???

I'm sure Hewitt and Bradley probably will have used it.

I haven't seen any threats accompanying male bodied person.

MB's response to 'terfy barrister'

Describes TERF as derogatory - MBs words

MB now knows TERF is abusive term

BC Is 'terfy barrister' derogatory?

MB waffle, waffle, waffle - says TERF is same as AB saying 'male bodied person' for a transwoman

MB don't know why I didn't call him out on it.

EJ need to have time for re-examination

MB: I wasn't on social media. Didn't really know what terf meant or how used then.

Such incuriosity from someone whose personal and professional (in her barrister role) focus seems to have been in this area.

I think something has gone wrong with Google Chrome while I was out. When you log in should microphone and camera say None or Default? Mine says None and when I try to change it I get the message that the browser can't access them....

Isn't it illegal to drive while you are on the phone?

Two young kids!

On holiday AGAIN!!

11.21
2 young kids
on holiday
Drink! Drink! Drink!

'I don't know what I was thinking at 11.31, I was with my kids, I was on holiday'

Holiday young ikds blah blah blah take issue with use of terf. very firm on that

“It was late, I have young kids, I was on holiday”

Change the record, there’s a dear <yawns>

BC is doing something worthwhile here, he's getting a high priest of gender identity ideology to agree that TERF is derogatoryr. Even if AB doesn't prevail, it's good for BC to use these proceedings to embed the fact that TERF is a slur into the legal consciousness of the UK.

@IloveHolby use Default

I've been trying to get back in for 1/2 an hour now 😖

How is describing someone as a male-bodied person' (rather than man which was always useful before but has been scrubbed out) anything like on a par with TERF?!

First page where you put your screen name should have the vid and mic ON.
second page to be set to none - they are your vid and mic.

They are male bodied, it's a biological fact, or there would be no need to consider "trans" anything. "Trans exclusionary" is a loaded statement. Which trans people?

If its the second stage, none is fine (I have that for my phone.) Keep trying. I've had to try 5 or 6 times today and it kicked me out somehow at one point. (I normally watch on laptop but have had to use phone today.)

How do we think this morning went?

Thanks @CatsOperatingInGangs - it won't let me. I don't know why - it was working fine before I logged off

Just realised there is a function to telephone into this to get an audio which then leaves your smartphone free to do other things.

I guess this is why there are phone numbers coming up in the participant boxes.

Why is she answering about contact with the Heads of Chambers, when he was asking about her agitating with other people?