Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 11

[ickky]

The Tribunal started on 25th April at 10am. If you would like to view online you need to send a request for access as early as possible.

Send an email to

[email protected]

The subject heading of the email request should read

“MEDIA OR PUBLIC ACCESS REQUEST – Case number 2202172/2020 - Ms A Bailey – 25th April 2022.

Then ask for the pin for the online access.

You will be contacted with instructions on how to observe the hearing.

When joining the live tribunal please choose a non inflammatory/offensive name, everyone can see it in the chat - This is a court room, please behave accordingly.

The court chat function is there for official court purposes, not for observers, please don't use it unless you have a technical issue.

On the first page underneath where you put your screen name, select the video and mic that are not crossed out (top option), this is the courts vid and mic.
On the next page select NONE on the drop down windows for vid and mic, these are your own video and mic.
You must be muted so as to not disturb the hearing.

There is also live tweeting from

twitter.com/tribunaltweets

Abbreviations:
AB: Allison Bailey, claimant
BC: Ben Cooper QC, barrister for AB
SW = Stonewall Equality Limited (respondent 1)
IO = Ijeoma Omambala QC, senior counsel - barrister for SW
RW = Robin White junior counsel to SW - assisting IO
GC = Garden Court Chambers Limited (respondent 2) (GCC would be a better abbreviation)
AH = Andrew Hochhauser QC, senior counsel - barrister for GC
JR = Jane Russell junior counsel to GC - assisting AH
RM= Rajiv Menon QC & SH = Stephanie Harrison QC (jointly respondent 3 along with all members of GC except AB)
EJ = Employment Judge Goodman hearing the case
Panel = any one of the three panel members (EJ and two lay members)

Thread 1 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4529887-Allison-Bailey-v-Stonewall-Employment-Tribunal-hearing?

Thread 2 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4542466-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-2

Thread 3 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4545725-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-3

Thread 4 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4546945-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-4

Thread 5 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4548160-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-5

Thread 6 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4550451-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-6

Thread 7 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4551757-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-7

Thread 8 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4552521-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-8

Thread 9 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553181-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-9

Thread 10 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553754-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-10

Allison Bailey - claimant (4-9, 11-13 May)

Witnesses for the claimant:

Dr Nicola Williams - Fair Play for Women (29 April)
Dr Judith Green - A Woman's Place (29 April)
Kate Barker - LGB Alliance (3 May)
Lisa-Marie Taylor - FiLiA (4 May)

Witnesses for the respondents:

Stephen Lue - barrister for GCC (3-4 May)
Zainab Al-Farabi - ex Stonewall (10 May)
Kirrin Medcalf - head of trans inclusion Stonewall (10 May)
Leslie Thomas - barrister at GCC (13 May)
Sanjay Sood Smith - Stonewall (16 May)
Shaan Knan - LGBT consortium - on STAG (16 May)
Rajiv Menon - joint head of chambers (16-17 May)
Maya Sikand - barrister at GCC (17-18 May)
Mia Hakl-Law - HR senior for GCC (18 May)
Judy Khan - barrister at GCC (19-20 May)
Charlie Tennent - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Luke Harvey - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Louise Hooper - Barrister at GCC (20 May)
Marc Willers - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Stephen Clark - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Liz Davies - Barrister at GCC (23 May)

To come?

Tom Wainwright - Barrister at GCC (24 May)
David Renton - barrister at GCC (20 May, to continue on 25th May)
Stephanie Harrison - joint head of chambers
Michelle Brewer - barrister at GCC at time, now left and a judge.
David de Menezes - GCC, Head of Marketing

Just caught up again and deeply shocked by all that has gone on this morning . Us lesbians are not surprised though, for years we have tried to defend our groups against the entry of males who like “overcoming barriers” . It is good to see this centre stage. Everywhere now it seems that only the Ts matter. The whole issue of “distress” claimed if men don’t get what they want, counts for nothing if lesbians or women are subjected to this gaslighting and abuse. The legal profession seems to be at one with SW. incredulous how this has happened .

‘So BC got to choose the order of witnesses? I was wondering about that, the escalation of witness insanity didn't seem like it could be a coincidence.’

I would assume he does apart from unavailability. They’re there for him to cross-examine.

Am on toddler duty today and so only sporadically catching up, but fucking hell… Will have a proper catch-up later. Thank you all as always for the updates and analysis.

AH getting snappy with the EJ. She’s going to eat him.

Oh they won't like that.

It's a Sicilian message. Cathryn McGahey sleeps with the fishes.

AH just patronised the judge!!! Not a good strategy.

AH is fuming.

AH condescending to the Judge there

AH interrupting the judge and telling how it works. 😮😮

OMG was AH just breathtakingly rude to EJ? He actually told her it's important to listen to the questions?

EJ: sigh "Mr Cooper, would you like to start again?"

CMcG giving great example of coercion by shaming in bringing up apartheid and comparing sexual orientation to racism. That is exactly the sort of pressure that is being put on lesbians. Hope EJ notes that.

Regarding coercion, could BC make reference to the evidence from the BBC article about lesbians being pressured into sex with men?

@TastefulRainbowUnicorn
The smirking will be because of the cognitive dissonance.

I wonder if she volunteered because of her “interest” in this area. You can see why most would not want to touch it, given the toxic debate. So much for impartiality Bar Council. Disgraceful.

I hope he explores why heterosexual women weren't targeted.

Let's have that out there, too. That lesbians not only have to have sex with males, the reason is also to validate the The gender identity of the male in question.

God, AH and his pointless interruptions. EJ Goodman has his number though.

CG can now no longer string a sentence together.

Indeed, Datun.

I’d like to see her witness statement so I can see who contacted her from GCC. She is not objective.

@BellaAmorosa EXACTLY - CM just DEMONSTRATED the thing she was trying to disprove! She demonstrated the level of SHAMING that is used to try to COERCE lesbians to have sex with male bodies - if lesbians refuse, they are told they are being as discriminatory as apartheid South Africa!!!!

Just caught up, thank you @ickky and everyone. Probably because of all the apartheid I misread that BC's wren was black, which gave me a moment!

If this shower are typical of the legal system in the UK, inc. the police and the CPS, it's no wonder rape convictions are as they are.

She's faltering a bit now. I don't think she feels so sure of herself now but is still having to justify the line she took.

She claims no monopoly on the truth of this. I submit she doesn't even have the old boot of the truth on this.

CM saying that her test was simply the reasonable reader. But her interpretation is that this must be the reasonable reader who is uninformed and takes things only at first glance.

This open homophobia is startling. Right Side of History too.

Is one of Allison's claims also discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation PC? Or is is sex and beliefs?

Hochhauser doesn’t want anyone hearing any more of this, does he?