NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #38

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #29 can be found in the header of thread #30.

Thread 30: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375337-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-30
Thread 31: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375819-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-31
Thread 32: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376072-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-32
Thread 33: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376608-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-33
Thread 34: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5377387-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-34
Thread 35: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5377598-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-35
Thread 36 mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5378031-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-36
Thread 37: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5378200-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-37

That is eerily close to the opening page of Isherwood’s Goodbye to Berlin that was the basis of I am a camera and, later, Cabaret.

This is such a tawdry way for the respondents to handle a matter that they knew was potentially a matter for referral to regulators and career-ending.

A transwoman in a woman’s space is not the definition of predatory. No.

Anywqy, back to the proceedings shall we?

Please let's not let Tandora's box spoil the opening of Pandora's box.

All Rise! (as Blue would say but the ET definitely would not)

Who asked "why aren't you getting changed?".

A man in a woman’s space is predatory. A trans woman is a man.

I think that was Darlington Red

That's "rose" in Darlington

The bloke in the Darlington case

I think that was the fragrant bloke in the Darlington changing room.

I think the word 'illegally' is missing as in 'illegally permitted by employer'.

I don't think whether DU is predatory or not is an issue.
SP had been avoiding using the CR when he was present in a quiet way, just leaving or waiting.
This time she couldn't avoid, asked him to leave please, presumably was then pushed to justify herself so explained.

That shouldn't have led to DU crying all over the place, raising complaints, making things up about patient care etc.

Wrong tribunal. That's Darlington.

I really don't think anyone was naked! During the Christmas Eve incident, Upton was preparing to go home and I remember him describing roughly what he was wearing in the February hearing, he was at the coat putting on stage, or thereabouts. Sandie would have been in scrubs and, as we know, was wanting to sort herself out after a heavy menstrual bleed. But not naked.

True. This is the one who said on the witness stand that he knowingly overrides the consent of vulnerable women patients.

When I get a chance (veh busy life these days) I would tend to read modern Sci Fi. Banks, Reynolds, Tchaikovsky, Liu Cixin, Hamilton. Recently sucked into an epic 42 book sequence of children's books about feral cats due to reading them to DD8.

Could she or others be called back due to the non-disclosure of a vital piece of evidence which shows possible collusion between some witnesses?

On to the good stuff

Here it comes...!

I ended up adding all the kid novels to my goodreads to keep my tally up, I was reading more to him than myself! There's some really average kid lit about. He did get me into Pratchett, which was much fun.

KS didn't think her personal emails in a closed group would be made public!

How's that working out for ya?

Wow, KS has thrown NHS Fife under the bus there, saying she didn't know that emails sent to a closed group would be disclosed!

Tawdry indeed.

JR wanted to demonstrate SP was sufficiently performing upset to be understood to have suffered a detriment.

NC establishes that she was part of the group discussing the I/x whilst as SP’s line manager also following instructions to tell Sandy she is not allowed to talk about it.

When asked by NC why she didn’t submit the email with original she can’t remember and on asked about curtailing SP’s ability to talk about I/x claims they were all told not to discuss is which they didn’t ’APART FROM THOSE EMAILS’

That’s the BOOM