NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #38

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #29 can be found in the header of thread #30.

Thread 30: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375337-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-30
Thread 31: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375819-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-31
Thread 32: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376072-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-32
Thread 33: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376608-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-33
Thread 34: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5377387-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-34
Thread 35: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5377598-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-35
Thread 36 mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5378031-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-36
Thread 37: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5378200-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-37

Make a complaint and do an FOI to them to ask them about their policies on this matter. Ask them if their staff self ID and whether they are compliant with single sex spaces following the Supreme Court. They are a public body and accountable to us as taxpayers and licence fee payers.

It didn't matter so much after proceedings had finished for the day yesterday, but I strongly suggest we don't give crapflooders what they want today. They want to bury all the damning and important stuff - don't let them.

it really is shocking and to think they charge a tv license fee for this rubbish.. i think most people have more than one source by now so all the BBC are doing is outing themselves as biased reporters 🤷‍♀️

Yes, I'm very glad to have been 'in the room' for parts of this one.

We don't describe body language etc unless it's extreme and impacting the evidence. It's very subjective. TBF we are generally so relieved by any pauses so we can catch up that we tend not to notice them until they get really long. Like NC yesterday trying to sort out the email chains.

Thank you @nauticant Doing good work here. Creating and maintaining a place for people to talk is a lifeline - many GC women self censoring in their lives.

I personally try not to feed the trolls because it's minutes of my life I'll never get back.

Thanks nauticant. My husband got interested enough to read the BBC and realised how biased one of the headlines was. I have directed him to the Scottish press.

As I'm not watching I do appreciate it when one of those who are comments on demeanour. Wouldnt expect TT to do this as they need all their concentration for the words.

I appreciate Searle made a few major whoopsies yesterday , but I keep thinking about this one.

What does Gender Critical mean?

”they’re critical about sex and chromosomes”

ITS RIGHT THERE IN THE NAME Ffs

No wonder those captured in the NHS are happy to use shite terms like chest feeding and say that men are women. They’ve not a clue.

Good morning all.
Quick question is there going to be any witnesses before ks at 11:30?

I also think commenting on demeanour would be a step out of the impartiality they’re trying to achieve.

Many thanks to TT @Justabaker and to @nauticant

Fifer : mah we grannie on mither's side hid a sayin for this. She hid a sayin for onyhing you kid hink ay, mind. "Jist stick tae yer knittin". In case it flew oor yer heid, the knittin in this case is the discussion ay Wee Sondie's tribunal. Imagine the discussion is a braw warm jumper we're a knittin the gither. A hope oor support feels like that tae Wee Sondie.

It is what it is. You can't control it. You just have to roll with it. And find a sense of humour. You are currently peak crazy thread. It will calm. I don't quite have a t-shirt but I do have the MN mug to prove this.

Keep on carrying on. Say if it gets too much. x

Not to derail, but I feel the humble celeriac chip has not been given enough credit.

Does anyone else feel like Kate Searle Day is getting out of hand nowadays? I mean, I know it's really for the kids and that but extending it into two days is a bit much especially with the cost of living at the moment. All the preparations, the excitement and anticipation and now a whole extra day of festivities. It really makes me wonder whether we've forgotten the true meaning of KSD; to celebrate the honesty of doctors throughout the world and remind ourselves to always trust them no matter what.

Now we know why there's a long NHS waiting list - they're still trying to figure out each patients sex.

Thank you @nauticant great work again.

That was wise. The signal-to-noise ratio over that part was the poorest we've had on these threads.

And that was the intention. It's ok, if we don't give it oxygen during proceedings it'll just puff itself out. It's actually kind of a good thing, a sign of panic and desperation, which is exactly what deluded TRAs should be feeling. What an absolute shitshow for them!

They need to figure out their own,apparently

It's not the first time and it won't be the last, they've got nothing else to give.

Thanks Guiness, actually laughed out loud at that one. Yes, let's all take a quiet moment together to think about the trustworthiness of all Drs everywhere

Excellent idea!

Does anyone think Fife will find rock up with the missing email?

I'd love to know whats in it, will the IT guys find it?

@guinnessguzzler I think Kate Searle Day has been overcommercialised, an opinion I've long held – it used to be under, but now it’s over.

Does anyone have an insight into starting time today? The judge said a starting time of 11.30 but that was specifically for KS, while the discussion up to that suggested that he might put another witness into the 10-11.30 (sic) slot.

I wasn't sure if they were going to squeeze the IT guy in before 11.30 or if they anticipated another case management stramash first thing?