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Original poster

NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #27

1000 replies

nauticant · 13/07/2025 08:26

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It will resume on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions wereFri provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

OP posts:

Thread gallery

Seriestwo · 16/07/2025 09:19

I’ve logged in but there is nothing happening yet, not even the soothing voice

Original poster

nauticant · 16/07/2025 09:20

I'm well behind so might be repeating stuff upthread:

Note the following from the Guidance for CVP Observers:

Please insert your full name and the capacity in which you are joining the hearing
Eg: Joe Bloggs – Observer OR Jane Doe - Reporter

OP posts:

ickky · 16/07/2025 09:21

Can't believe the timing of the gross misconduct disciplinary, it is just to fuck with her before the hearing starts.

What a bunch of cunts.

Original poster

nauticant · 16/07/2025 09:21

IMPORTANT NOTICE.

According to PRESIDENTIAL GUIDANCE ON OPEN JUSTICE IN EMPLOYMENT TRIBUNAL PROCEEDINGS IN SCOTLAND dated 14 July 2025:

... members of the public who are observing a hearing ... remotely, and who wish to use live, text based communications during the hearing, must apply to the Tribunal for permission.

www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/07/Presidential-Guidance-Open-Justice-in-Employment-Tribunal-Proceedings-in-Scotland.pdf

The term "live, text based communications" could include Mumsnet Talk and assuming it does then we need to follow the Presidential Guidance.

OP posts:

GCITC · 16/07/2025 09:24

nauticant · 16/07/2025 09:21

IMPORTANT NOTICE.

According to PRESIDENTIAL GUIDANCE ON OPEN JUSTICE IN EMPLOYMENT TRIBUNAL PROCEEDINGS IN SCOTLAND dated 14 July 2025:

... members of the public who are observing a hearing ... remotely, and who wish to use live, text based communications during the hearing, must apply to the Tribunal for permission.

www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/07/Presidential-Guidance-Open-Justice-in-Employment-Tribunal-Proceedings-in-Scotland.pdf

The term "live, text based communications" could include Mumsnet Talk and assuming it does then we need to follow the Presidential Guidance.

I haven't received a response from my email yet. When I can observe I will ask for the Clerks email address to see if they can give more clarification.

Americano75 · 16/07/2025 09:24

Get in!

potpourree · 16/07/2025 09:26

Trans changing room row nurse cleared of misconduct as tribunal resumes

BBC headline - who is trans in this sentence? Not the "nurse", as that's Sandy. The changing rooms? That's a bold claim to make?

OverripeBananaBread · 16/07/2025 09:27

BezMills · 16/07/2025 09:08

I know it's all very serious, but some of the posts in here this morning have made me miss the LOL react.

Was just thinking that. Have gone through using the others but they're not quite what I mean to say.....

Harassedevictee · 16/07/2025 09:28

anyolddinosaur · 15/07/2025 17:13

Wbat NHS Fife actually said on their website "On the ongoing employment tribunal, NHS Fife’s spokesperson added: “The claimant has said, in her statement, that she is determined to continue with her legal claim. The claimant is of course entitled to pursue her legal action. As a result, NHS Fife, as respondent, shall be required to continue to defend the case through the appropriate legal process. The case involves a range of complex matters, including an internal investigation that was initiated following concerns raised by a member of staff. NHS Fife believes it had a responsibility to fully investigate such matters.”"

Which I interpret a "that pesky woman wont just drop her case so we have to go on defending it". Nothing to suggest they have made her an offer to settle. I suspect we'll only find that out in a discussion about costs.

I thought Kate Searle had been listed on the GMC registration, but thread 17 says not. Still very interesting that Fife didnt care about protecting the anonymity of any of it's witnesses except Searle and Upton. Now does anyone know if the responsible officer being unchanged means Upton still works for Fife or just that he doesnt have a job elsewhere yet?

@GargoylesofBeelzebub This was the post I was referring to.

Didshejustsaythatoutloud · 16/07/2025 09:29

Leafstamp · 13/07/2025 13:51

From X:

Remember that Dr Upton imposes his lie not only on staff but on patients. He admits he does not inform them, stops only if they object, knowing that many patients cannot. Others can, but would not dare. Touching patients without full consent is a criminal act, an abuse of power.

Dr Upton stated that even after a female patient makes a specific request for female-only care, he will still attempt to treat her as if he were female, without discussion. She has to object for him to stop. He knowingly treats against consent: an admission of serious misconduct.

https://x.com/dearrebelada/status/1944309365915476467?s=46

That's disturbing 😮
He has no shame

kittykarate · 16/07/2025 09:31

Merrymouse · 16/07/2025 08:36

Why would they announce this the evening before the tribunal?

Why not at least a few days before?

Wasn't this misconduct hearing only last Friday? I'm amazed they turned it around so quickly to be honest.

CriticalCondition · 16/07/2025 09:33

Yes! WFTCHTJ

The mix of joy and anger this latest news brings. The utter bastards. Sandie is an absolute shero.

Roomforapony · 16/07/2025 09:33

RedNine · 15/07/2025 23:44

An anti EMF bracelet? That's Unbelievable

did you see what I did there?

Show quote history

🙌🏻 😂

BettyBooper · 16/07/2025 09:33

kittykarate · 16/07/2025 09:31

Wasn't this misconduct hearing only last Friday? I'm amazed they turned it around so quickly to be honest.

Show quote history

It was on 25 June

123ZYX · 16/07/2025 09:34

potpourree · 16/07/2025 09:26

Trans changing room row nurse cleared of misconduct as tribunal resumes

BBC headline - who is trans in this sentence? Not the "nurse", as that's Sandy. The changing rooms? That's a bold claim to make?

The changing rooms started out female and later identified as mixed sex.

Pinknotpurple · 16/07/2025 09:34

Put off the misconduct hearing as long as possible didn't they. Not looking at all good for Fife

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 16/07/2025 09:35

I've got so much to do for the end of term, but neeeeeed to be here too.

Am questioning my life choices now.

Come on, exonerated Nurse Peggie!

TWETMIRF · 16/07/2025 09:36

Needspaceforlego · 15/07/2025 21:28

Totally agree.
She is 100% doing the right thing. Absolutely amazing lady. I have so much admiration and respect for her.
She is carrying the rights of every single person in the UK on her shoulders. Many men wouldn't want to share single sex spaces with transmen (women in disguise) either.

You can absolutely guarantee that they'll be others who were equally uncomfortable in that changing room but weren't brave enough to come forward and fight.
Brave maybe isn't the right word because they'll be a load of reasons why people don't want to fight, the bullying by NHS Fife (ie suspension), fear of ruining promotion prospects, unable to risk financial security, MH reasons.

Show quote history

You've given me a new earworm. To the theme of the original Transformers cartoon:

Transmen are, women in disguise. Transwomen, are men in disguise

Harassedevictee · 16/07/2025 09:36

GCITC · 16/07/2025 09:24

I haven't received a response from my email yet. When I can observe I will ask for the Clerks email address to see if they can give more clarification.

Show quote history

Check your Spam folders. The acknowledgement did say they would not email people who weren’t granted access. There was a cut off at 300. Sorry.

chilling19 · 16/07/2025 09:36

Wftchtj

Ereshkigalangcleg · 16/07/2025 09:37

EternalLodga · 16/07/2025 09:09

There's this thread on Reddit, interestingly nobody has jumped on to mention tje latest plot twist

https://www.reddit.com/r/transgenderUK/comments/1lyur4b/if_dr_upton_is_out_there_or_if_anyone_knows_her/

There’s this update on r/Scotland with a few angry TRAs. It will get shared over on TRA Reddit eventually because many of them love to play the victim.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Scotland/s/KGykRu7Jyx

GargoylesofBeelzebub · 16/07/2025 09:37

@Harassedevictee thanks!!

MarieDeGournay · 16/07/2025 09:37

Because I know this thread moves like lightning, I went back a few pages when I opened it this morning, so the news of the dismissal of the gross misconduct allegations - which I always thought were the nastiest and most damaging - appeared out of the blue as I caught up the thread.

Great news - congratulations to Nurse Sandie Peggie for having your competence and commitment to your profession confirmed.
Good luck with the rest of the tribunal, may you be vindicated!

Cat amongst pigeons for the tribunal!

Laugh emojis most keenly missed for
EMF bracelet - that's Unbelievable
NC sitting back in her chair, with a cigar and a whisky and one raised eyebrow.

Thank you to both of you - names forgotten at this point, it's been so exciting! for making me laugh out loud😂

I see upthread that the EMF joke was RedNine, so chapeau to you😃

Original poster

nauticant · 16/07/2025 09:38

Tried to log on using a Firefox browser, it worked but no sound. Then used my Chrome browser and that got me sound and vision.

OP posts:

ThreeWordHarpy · 16/07/2025 09:40

@BoreOfWhabylon , @ILikeDungs i have sent a polite note to the email address noting that first come first served didn’t seem to be used for my application and please could they add me to the waiting list for online observer spaces.

i imagine they are incredibly busy this morning so don’t expect a speedy reply.

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