My therapist fired me

[RaineyMae]

We had an agreement that I was allowed to email (with paid for reading time).

The content of one batch of emails got emotive and she took it as criticism.

Fired me by email on the grounds that I am ‘overwhelming’.

Ghosted my apology for upsetting her and my request for a termination session.

AIBU to feel hard done by?

@mathanxiety

...defining a person as abnormal because they have a neurodevelopmental condition is deeply offensive and disablist. YY to this *@LonginesPrime*

Sure whatever Longines. You use the language you like and are comfortable with, I'll use the language I like and am comfortable with. If I come across a compelling reason to change it, I will. Your offence isn't compelling enough

You live in this world among people who speak English, @FrankensteinIsTheMonster.

The meaning and the weight of the words you use isn't something you can randomly assign according to your own convenience and taste and then shrug when someone points out to you that the words you use are offensive.

Some words are objectively objectionable. I can think of many examples. Some are racist. Some are sexist. Some are ageist. Some are ableist. You can't use them.

You especially can't use them and tell people who are offended that you intend to keep on using them because you have your own private language, that your comfort with your own private language trumps their right not to be injured by the ideas expressed in the language you choose to use, ideas which have historically been the basis of discrimination against many groups of people, and that you feel no obligation to consider the fact that you are addressing real, live, sentient other people.

Don't be ridiculous. There are no words I "can't" use. Of course I can use them. I just have to accept the consequences of using them, which in this case is a few people on Mumsnet getting aeriated. 🤷🏼‍♂️

There are ways to describe people that are offensive. Why are you ok with using language that others find offensive?

As a parent of a dc with ASD and someone with probable ADHD myself I loved normie - really made me chuckle.

@Longestfewdaysupcoming

There are ways to describe people that are offensive. Why are you ok with using language that others find offensive?

Cause I really don't care that you're offended.

I care that OP is able to work out what went wrong and what she can do differently in future to avoid the same happening again, and that she is able to do so without unproductively berating herself for what went wrong here.

But I don't care about the opinions of randoms on whether I choose to jokily refer to non-autistics as normies, when trying to make a personal connection with another autistic person who's going through a really difficult time and being misunderstood. So I won't be engaging with any more discussion about my terribly offensive language.

So you’re just going to be offensive and you think that’s ok.

That’s rather nasty and unpleasant. And how do you know I’m a “normie” anyway?

FrankensteinIsTheMonster
People are telling you that your description of other people's level of neurotypical behaviour and neurodiverse behaviour is offensive because you're labelling people as abnormal, "normies" etc.

Even after they said they found it offensive, you continued to call them a normie.

You're just being unpleasant and goady.

I think more than "a few people on mn" would find it offensive to say that people who has ASD are not normal.

Shocking that language like this is still in use, really.

I can't read the whole thread but I have read your posts.

A few things stand out to me (I've been in therapy for 10+ years with various different modalities).

1. Therapists won't give you advice or their opinions on a situation. Depending on the modality, they will do different things to help you make sense of what you've gone to them for, but they are never going to give their opinion on whether you were right, wrong, etc. At best, you might get validation - 'I can see how hard that must have been for you', or permission - 'you are allowed to feel negatively about what they did', but good, safe, boundaried therapists should not be giving advice or opinions.

1. They really don't need to know specifics. Whether something happened on day a or day b, or what came first etc is completely irrelevant. Firstly there is no way at all they can remember that level of detail about every client, so it just isn't worth your time sending it, and secondly, what matters in therapy is how you reacted to the situation and what mattered to you, or how you felt about it. For example, I experienced a very traumatic pregnancy and birth. In therapy, I have never told the whole story in a monologue of facts and times. I might start a session by saying (e.g. and this isn't my story, I'm just giving an example) 'I want to talk today about the time that the midwife told me my baby's heartrate was showing signs of distress', and then the therapist would talk about that. They don't need to know (and probably don't care and have no capacity to remember) that that happened on a Tuesday in the morning before the doctor came round but after my husband came in but hang on a minute did I tell you last week the doctors had already been there......... it really does not matter. At all. Your feelings and the way you related to the situation matter.

I do think it would benefit you to consider further what you can actually reasonably achieve out of therapy. If you're looking for advice, you need to go topic specific helplines and support groups with people with lived experience. If you're looking to process it with an impartial person, therapy is for you.

Having said all of that, this therapist handled this poorly. There are no set, absolute boundaries in therapy, so long as there ARE boundaries. Responding to emails out of session is totally normal for some therapists. Squeezing in a five minute chat in an awful day is something my therapist has always been happy to do, so long as she is working and has the availability. But some carve out their boundaries differently and it is important you understand that from the beginning with anyone you work with in the future.

It was not okay for your therapist to cut you off without an ending session, unless there is something you have missed out (threats, violence or therapist illness/unforeseen circumstance). It was not okay and I understand why you are feeling so hurt by it.

Best of luck today.

Neurodiverse people have used the word normie for many years. People get upset over everything nowadays.

Bronson2
How awful for adults to expect other adults to refrain from name calling based on how neurodiverse or neurotypical someone thinks someone else is.

You're right, people get upset about all sorts. What's a bit of lazy assumptions about other people's level of neurodiversity? It's just good old fun to continue when someone asks you to stop.

(Sarcasm)

@LolaSmiles

Bronson2 How awful for adults to expect other adults to refrain from name calling based on how neurodiverse or neurotypical someone thinks someone else is.

You're right, people get upset about all sorts. What's a bit of lazy assumptions about other people's level of neurodiversity? It's just good old fun to continue when someone asks you to stop.

(Sarcasm)

This.

All I was doing was adding some context to the word. This thread isn't becoming about the op anymore. I'm out.

Longestfewdaysupcoming
The people get upset at everything these days is just another version of schoolkids saying "it was just banter... it was just a joke" as a way to excuse being unpleasant.

People being unpleasant about disability, special needs, neurodiversity, race, sex, religion etc seem to regularly dress it up as a joke, as if the responsibility is on the person receiving the comments to lighten up, instead of the 'joker' to avoid being offensive.

I agree @LolaSmiles. It’s peculiar how it’s still ok with regards to disability but it wouldn’t be ok with regards to sex/gender or race for example.

I agree. It's a shame the OP's thread ended up going this way because one poster would rather insist on their right to speak about neurotypical and neurodiverse people in this way.

Hopefully the OP is able to get on with her day.

@Longestfewdaysupcoming

I agree *@LolaSmiles*. It’s peculiar how it’s still ok with regards to disability but it wouldn’t be ok with regards to sex/gender or race for example.

Doesn't that depend on whether the poster is neurodiverse herself?

Like when black people use the n word.

Ok so compare it to the N word.

Someone uses it to describe you. You say. I don’t like that word being used to describe me and people like me. Please don’t use it towards me again.

And the poster goes “problem N word 😜” and that would be ok? Somehow I don’t think so.

Anyone on here blaming the OP has no idea how therapy works. It is the therapists job to sort everything that comes up in the relationship. And to whoever mentioned 'weird codependency' number 1. Weird is a very unhelpful word and 2. It is extremely common for people to fall in love with their therapists (not that that is what OP has done) and have intense emotional reactions and responses both in and out of the therapy room. That is the NATURE of therapy. That's why therapists have supervisors - to deal with their own emotional responses to their clients' emotional responses.

The therapist was completely in the wrong. It is for them to define the boundaries of the relationship and stick with them, then deal with it appropriately if the boundaries are breached. Ghosting is never an appropriate response and she acted extremely unprofessionally. I would certainly consider reporting to her board of professional ethics.

[quote Tangled22]**@eekbumbler* The other qualifications can be achieved with the shoddiest of courses.*

I don’t know anything about psychologists, but it takes a minimum of 4+ years study to postgraduate level, and 450 hours of clinical practice to register as a licensed psychotherapist. So no, you are wrong.[/quote]
@Tangled22 - If you read the post properly I was not including psychotherapy, psychology or psychiatry.

I was referring to those that set themselves up as counsellors with minimum qualifications or a £120 course advertised on the net.

Also I researched my pyschotherapist some years later - he wasn't even fully qualified.

So don't tell me I'm wrong when you clearly cannot understand a post, let alone what and whom I have had to deal with.

I hope you're not in the profession!

NotNow I think some of us have quite a good idea re therapy, actually. This is my professional field.

I think "ghosting" is a weighted term. The therapist communicated the end of the relationship and then didn't reply to further communications. I don't think that is ghosting.

I understand the op is upset about the use of the word "overwhelming", but it is really hard for us to comment on which a wider context of what was said. There's a world of difference between "I don't want to work with you because I find you overwhelming" and "The overwhelming volume of communication makes me think our relationship isn't productive". But, I don't mean this is attempt to undermine the ops experience - she is hurt and that is understandable, because the relationship didn't go as she hoped.

ObviousNameChage

On mumsnet people have no idea who they are speaking to, or whether the people they are speaking to are NT or ND. The poster saying normies and referring to ND people as abnormal has no idea about the people they're talking to, but seem to think that it doesn't matter what they say about NT/ND people.

I'm not sure it needs comparing to the N word to be honest.
It's more like:
Person A: (insert term here)
Person B: please don't use that term, i find it offensive because...
Person A: OK (term)
Person B: I've already said that's quite offensive
Person A: I don't care if you find (term) offensive. I can say what I like.

@eekbumbler Your post said:

Psychotherapy ruined my life for years. I'm not even sure what a Psychologist is either.

The only way I ever made sense of my life, including the damage done by psychotherapy was to see a psychiatrist.

The other qualifications can be achieved with the shoddiest of courses.

Which made it sound like psychiatry = good. Psychotherapy and psychology = the "other qualifications" you refer to. You didn't mention unqualified counsellors in your post at all....

For info. It takes at least 7 years to qualify at doctoral level as a Clinical Psychologist.

Hi OP, I hope the surgery has gone as planned and that you are feeling ok.
My opinion is that your therapist should have been clearer about boundaries, sooner, and had a final conversation with you. Even if it they just said that they are not the right person to help you.
I believe that talking therapy is not always the right thing for people with ASD. I have been seeing a therapist who specialises in ASD brains, to try and save my NT-ASD marriage (I'm NT) and she has really enlightened me as to what I could do to de-escalate my ASD husband's anxiety and obsessions. She is humane, boundaried and aware, even when I've been feeling like I'm in crisis. She recognises that some ASD adults won't accept her help, but you sound self-aware and ready for help.
PLEASE see that the way it ended was due to her lack of experience and not in any way your fault. One of the most important therapeutic goals is self-acceptance and she has really screwed that one up. You are helpable, but you need someone who understands neurodivergance and you need to relinquish your need for control and details and trust in NT knowledge.

I hope that your surgery today goes well