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Conflict in the Middle East

To think it’s turning into genocide in real time part 2

751 replies

Everythingnotsavedwillbelost73 · 22/10/2023 08:43

First thread here but it’s full
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4918938-to-think-its-turning-into-genocide-in-real-time?page=1

Medical Aid to Palestine posted this thread on facebook describing the scenes in Gaza as being like the last days of humanity with one of their staff members having to search through piles of bodies to find his 13 year old niece https://www.facebook.com/100064712829372/posts/pfbid028yxpzimtA3apA6CSs8dEhJBd16rYUQR6QjFidEpwRCZzPVYoeJezX8nDrtZP2UZRl/?app=fbl

The main stream press aren’t really addressing the horror of what is happening (bar maybe Channel 4 news and Al Jazeera) - it’s a sanitised version.

As I said in the original thread, there has been absolute horror on both sides but the Israeli government are inflicting collective punishment on the people of Gaza, which is a war crime under international law.

I still feel we are watching genocide in real time.

To think it’s turning into genocide in real time | Mumsnet

Just seen this on the news- how can this be right? It genuinely is starting to feel like genocide. What Hamas did was beyond appalling. But this i...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4918938-to-think-its-turning-into-genocide-in-real-time?page=1

OP posts:

Am I being unreasonable?

177 votes. Final results.

POLL
You are being unreasonable
31%
You are NOT being unreasonable
69%
Poudretteite · 26/10/2023 20:43

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 20:36

@Poudretteite how many innocent civilians does Israel need to kill before they feel “safe”?

Where is the line?

What do you mean, feel 'safe'? Do you not understand that a terrorist group with a mandate for Jewish genocide just committed the deadliest terror attack since the Holocaust? Why the sneery quotes, as if its some ridiculous delusion?

They need to dismantle the terrorist group which will be difficult as the terrorists operate from civilian buildings, don't allow their citizens to evacuate and tell them to ignore IDF warnings.

The only other option is to allow the continued torture and murder of Israeli civilians - and the number that Hamas needs to kill to fulfil their aims is...all of them.

SarahC50 · 26/10/2023 21:04

@Poudretteite I am in shock that anyone is still defending the genocide that Israel is causing. It is indefensible what they are doing utterly indefensible, anyone who is human and has a soul can see that it is wrong on every level utterly disproportionate. And yes I condemn what Hamas did before you jump on that.

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 21:05

@Poudretteite that doesn’t answer my question at all. You’ve joined a thread discussing the genocide of people in Gaza so my question is in relation to that.

Where is the line for Israel? Because it looks like Israel also wants to kill everybody in Gaza.

If we allow Hamas and Israel to do what they want there will be nobody left. Do you not see that?

Fairtobefairohhhhhc · 26/10/2023 21:11

@Poudretteite israel has the largest and most functional high tec military in the world and they really need to target civilians houses and hospitals to target terrorists.
... if you believe that then you will believe anything.

SarahC50 · 26/10/2023 21:16

@Fairtobefairohhhhhc exactly and this advanced army is at war with a country that has no actual army!

I am absolutely sickened that people are still defending the IDF it's vile

Fairtobefairohhhhhc · 26/10/2023 21:19

The problem is @Sippingmytea many people just watch main stream.media news and listen and believe everything israel say.... because they would never lie, would they????? Even though so many things have been proven to be lies and false info. But unfortunately the world doesn't are because they don't see Palestinians as humans.

Palestinians are some of the only religious people who take their faiths, yes faiths, they aren't all Muslims, seriously. They still thank god like Job.

Please see below:
Where is the book of Job in the Torah?
the Ketuvim
It is found in the third section of the biblical canon known as the Ketuvim (“Writings”). The book's theme is the eternal problem of unmerited suffering, and it is named after its central character, Job, who attempts to understand the sufferings that engulf him.

Palestinians are basically living Jobs! Who is in the Torah. How ironic, that their oppressors belive in the same prophet.

Fairtobefairohhhhhc · 26/10/2023 21:20

If people spent a bit more time researching things properly and listening to both sides they might have better opinions



This is an interesting watch. But i doubt anyone will watch it as its an hour long. Top easy to close our eyes and swipe
Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 21:24

I think this is what it comes down to. Some people don’t see Palestinians as human (I can’t believe I’m even having to write this). Of course Israeli’s are humans - we see the innocent victim’s faces and names and what they enjoyed, their passions, their loved ones. It’s awful that they were killed.

But Palestinian’s are also humans. They also have names and faces and families. They had hopes and dreams before being killed.

If you can’t recognise that you are absolutely heartless.

Fairtobefairohhhhhc · 26/10/2023 21:25

Also israel is named after the prophet Jacob.. he was named Israel. So actually anyone religious would be entitled to live on the land that is now known as Israel. As its literally the land of Jacob. Who is a prophet of Christianity, Judaism and Islam. So technically Israel isn't Jewish. Its explained better in the YouTube link, as long as it isn't deleted

LindorDoubleChoc · 26/10/2023 21:25

What reason have HQ given for not moving this thread to the correct topic this time?

bness · 26/10/2023 21:27

I'm just in shock that people can still defend genocide

Im shocked that the world's largest independent organisations can call for a ceasefire, cite humanitarian crisis, warn of disaster, yet fellow human beings on here are still on what-about-ery to defend Israels

Its just so sickening and sad

bness · 26/10/2023 21:28

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 21:24

I think this is what it comes down to. Some people don’t see Palestinians as human (I can’t believe I’m even having to write this). Of course Israeli’s are humans - we see the innocent victim’s faces and names and what they enjoyed, their passions, their loved ones. It’s awful that they were killed.

But Palestinian’s are also humans. They also have names and faces and families. They had hopes and dreams before being killed.

If you can’t recognise that you are absolutely heartless.

Agree. They have been dehumanised so, so much, both by mainstream media and on here, it's openly said here that they brought this on themselves.

Its heartbreaking.

bness · 26/10/2023 21:33

I keep thinking of all those newscasters who expressed shock during the Ukraine conflict that they were "blond, blue eyed, just like us" who didn't deserve this, obv unlike those brown people who clearly did.

I don't think anyone would be talking about the merits of bombing blond people under any circumstances.

Jux · 26/10/2023 21:34

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Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 21:36

When Rishi Sunak tells Israel “I hope you win” what exactly are we winning? I don’t consider killing thousands of innocent people to be winning anything. It’s horrific.

Fairtobefairohhhhhc · 26/10/2023 21:37

@Sippingmytea if you have time have a look at the YouTube link I posted up. I think you.might find it interesting!

bness · 26/10/2023 21:47

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 21:36

When Rishi Sunak tells Israel “I hope you win” what exactly are we winning? I don’t consider killing thousands of innocent people to be winning anything. It’s horrific.

The choice of words is horrendous and callous. This is our leadership in this country. This is what they think of other human beings. What use is education and pre and think tanks and nobels when at the end of the day, we are all just the same as slave traders and holocaust architects and genocide drivers.

Leadership in this country, reflected back in parents on mumsnet. What a time to be alive.

Weddingpuzzle · 26/10/2023 22:06

I don't think it's binary. There isn't a need to say 'This is the bad side, this is the good side. This side is genocidal, no this side is' - where does it get anyone? Where is the diplomacy? (Hamas are abhorrent, they need to release hostages and think about who is encouraging them into carrying out crimes against humanity) Who is leading on de-escalation? (Threatening to turn Gaza 'into a car park', bombing south Gaza after telling people they'll be safe there and threatening Nakba is abhorrent and Isreal need to think about who is encouraging and funding them into carrying out crimes against humanity).

Where's the long term view about what political factions are manipulating who here? Where is the effort to find peace FFS? If your ideology is based on 'civility' and trying to be a democratic why as a state would you turn into what you purport to hate and reject?

Hamas has had a contingent in Russia today ffs. Iran (Hezbollah) will be rubbing their hands at the reactivity - they don't give a flying fuck about Palestinian civilians. They hate America and will stoke any fires to burn the West, encouraged by Russia. America are bleeding money and power (and internally are a mess, 500 odd mass shootings THIS YEAR), so the West is by proxy, and all the systems underlying it are scrabbling to retain it. And what are we doing? Where are the grown ups?

Amongst all these dick waving men ruling these countries (whose ego is so fragile they are more concerned with 'our ideology is supreme to yours' than dead babies - on both sides) are just normal people trying to live their life. It can't just he reduced to 'this side is bad, no this side is bad'. They are ALL bad. It's a tragedy of the human race that we can not learn from history and have a collective conscience to say 'that's enough'. It's beyond me, I don't know how it will happen but surely there's someone better and cleverer than us who can work it out?

IdoIdoIpoo · 26/10/2023 22:47

Heelenahandbasket · 26/10/2023 12:31

It’s a war. Not a genocide. Funny that actual racial attacks on Jewish people are “justified” or “not to be seen in a vacuum” etc yet a war by Israel against vile terrorists is “genocide” and “war crimes” etc.

There is no evidence of any war crimes committed by Israel. They don’t even control all the borders to Gaza. So stop lying

Wow! Incredible.

DrinkingMyWaterMindingMyBiz · 26/10/2023 22:53

Stylestuck · 26/10/2023 14:19

How do you suggest that the IDF target just Hamas? How, when Hamas are hiding out in the underground spiderweb, banning the civilians above them from leaving their homes so that they act as human shields?

Believe me, I am not a supporter of the Israeli government. What is happening in Gaza right now is an abomination. But Hamas are terrorists and cowards. I don’t know what the answer is.

I also feel really uncomfortable with the use of the word genocide in this context. Jews are some of the only true victims of genocide in history. I don’t feel that what Israel are doing right now is genocide. It’s fucking awful, but it’s not genocide.

Jews are some of the only true victims of genocide in history. 

This absolutely has to be the most insane comment I have ever read on Mumsnet. Ever.

I’m not even going to elaborate on why what you have just said is A) so wild and B) so incredibly insulting to the millions of displaced people around the world, because I don’t want to derail a thread about a very important and current situation. But you seriously need to read a few history books.

Fairtobefairohhhhhc · 26/10/2023 23:09

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bness · 26/10/2023 23:12

DrinkingMyWaterMindingMyBiz · 26/10/2023 22:53

Jews are some of the only true victims of genocide in history. 

This absolutely has to be the most insane comment I have ever read on Mumsnet. Ever.

I’m not even going to elaborate on why what you have just said is A) so wild and B) so incredibly insulting to the millions of displaced people around the world, because I don’t want to derail a thread about a very important and current situation. But you seriously need to read a few history books.

I am genuinely dazed at the sheer arrogance and self centeredness of this claim.

DrinkingMyWaterMindingMyBiz · 26/10/2023 23:16

@bness I’m honestly stunned. This is the first time a comment on here has made me genuinely angry. Such an ignorant, flippant comment from someone who clearly lives in an echo chamber has dehumanised so many millions of people without a second thought. Absolute madness.

Fairtobefairohhhhhc · 26/10/2023 23:22

Think people Bury their head in the sand because its easier! But, it will back fire one day. Don't be like sheep

Stylestuck · 26/10/2023 23:22

bness · 26/10/2023 23:12

I am genuinely dazed at the sheer arrogance and self centeredness of this claim.

I apologise - I worded that poorly. I am fully aware that since the term genocide was coined in the 1940s there have been 15-20 recorded genocides since. I should not have said “some of the only true victims” because this implies that there have been fewer than this. I of course do not believe that this is the case. I posted that in haste and I apologise again for any offence caused.

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