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Conflict in the Middle East

To think it’s turning into genocide in real time part 2

751 replies

Everythingnotsavedwillbelost73 · 22/10/2023 08:43

First thread here but it’s full
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4918938-to-think-its-turning-into-genocide-in-real-time?page=1

Medical Aid to Palestine posted this thread on facebook describing the scenes in Gaza as being like the last days of humanity with one of their staff members having to search through piles of bodies to find his 13 year old niece https://www.facebook.com/100064712829372/posts/pfbid028yxpzimtA3apA6CSs8dEhJBd16rYUQR6QjFidEpwRCZzPVYoeJezX8nDrtZP2UZRl/?app=fbl

The main stream press aren’t really addressing the horror of what is happening (bar maybe Channel 4 news and Al Jazeera) - it’s a sanitised version.

As I said in the original thread, there has been absolute horror on both sides but the Israeli government are inflicting collective punishment on the people of Gaza, which is a war crime under international law.

I still feel we are watching genocide in real time.

To think it’s turning into genocide in real time | Mumsnet

Just seen this on the news- how can this be right? It genuinely is starting to feel like genocide. What Hamas did was beyond appalling. But this i...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4918938-to-think-its-turning-into-genocide-in-real-time?page=1

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Everythingnotsavedwillbelost73 · 26/10/2023 15:57

Oh god, have we sunk to debating if hospitals are actually hospitals now to justify Israeli actions 🤦‍♀️

OP posts:
Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 15:59

Civilians are not collateral damage. These hospitals are sheltering thousands of families who have been forcibly displaced within the last 2 weeks. There are babies in the NICU, thousands of injured people, people who cannot medically be removed.

I don’t care who is hiding where. The moment innocent people are considered expendable, you have lost any moral argument.

WhiteRabbitBlackCat · 26/10/2023 16:05

I hope no one with a moral compass supports bombing a hospital, school, religious building, etc. in a war zone. Civilians deserve to be protected.

The issue here is a hospital where terrorists are deliberately hiding behind their own civilians, so that the only way to defeat the terrorists is to risk civilian lives. And it's deliberately a hospital BECAUSE morally decent people don't want to hurt ill, sick, newborn people, and don't want to make a choice to bomb them.

Hamas is in a win-win situation here: decent people do not bomb a hospital, Hamas has a place to store weapons etc. Decent people do bomb a hospital, the international community blames them for the deaths.

Hamas could choose not to risk those lives. They really could. They could stay the hell out of hospitals and announce them as safe zones. If they did so, and Israel ignored that, I would be hurling abuse at Bibi and the IDF for war crimes.

But Hamas chooses to stay in hospitals.

LolaSmiles · 26/10/2023 16:13

I don’t care who is hiding where. The moment innocent people are considered expendable, you have lost any moral argument
I agree.

I don't give a fuck what "side" people want to be on. I care that thousands of children are dying, civilians are being targeted via collective punishment and hospitals are being blown up.

Exactly how many children and civilians are expendable in the name of big wigs claiming victory? Nobody seems to answer this.

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 16:14

“decent people do not bomb a hospital”

Full stop.

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 16:19

@notimagain so you agree? You don’t need to hurry to find a link - any “side” that bombs hospitals, threatens to bomb hospitals or orders hospitals to evacuate is morally wrong.

MissyB1 · 26/10/2023 16:21

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 15:59

Civilians are not collateral damage. These hospitals are sheltering thousands of families who have been forcibly displaced within the last 2 weeks. There are babies in the NICU, thousands of injured people, people who cannot medically be removed.

I don’t care who is hiding where. The moment innocent people are considered expendable, you have lost any moral argument.

100% this 👆

Anyone who desperately scratches around looking for justification to bomb hospitals/schools /churches has got something very wrong with their morals.

I said it on another thread, it makes you shudder to think people who agree with doing this kind of shit walk among us.

juju99 · 26/10/2023 16:22

I came across this photographer who is documenting what’s happening on the ground. In one of his posts, he says he doesn’t know how much longer he will survive - I can’t imagine what that feels like.

I can’t believe that some people see what is happening and still feel it’s justified.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cyvt73EsqJe/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CyvUkvWsJC_/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

Instagram

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CyvUkvWsJC_/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 16:24

“Anyone who desperately scratches around looking for justification to bomb hospitals/schools /churches has got something very wrong with their morals. 

I said it on another thread, it makes you shudder to think people who agree with doing this kind of shit walk among us.”

@MissyB1 I completely agree. It’s scary to think that there are people that justify bombing civilians.

LolaSmiles · 26/10/2023 16:26

Anyone who desperately scratches around looking for justification to bomb hospitals/schools /churches has got something very wrong with their morals.

I said it on another thread, it makes you shudder to think people who agree with doing this kind of shit walk among us.

I agree with you.

The response to collectively punishing civilians, murdering thousands of children, blowing up hospitals and schools etc should be that it's disgusting so the adults better get their arses round the table and stop fighting over who has the biggest dick.

If anyone's response is "yeah but the other guys also did it" then I question the moral compass.

SarahC50 · 26/10/2023 16:30

Do you think when this vile genocide is over that Israel will face sanctions from the international community? They are acting with impunity and largely targeting civilians whilst denying them water and fuel.

They are ignoring appeals from the UN etc and I hope and pray that the tide is turning.

Most sane people feel sorry for the poor Palestinians as evidenced by the massive marches at the weekend,flags at the Celtic match etc. This support is getting no media coverage.

Rishi has got it badly wrong and misjudged what most people in the UK feel. I have written to my MP and MSP regarding this.

I hope and pray it ends soon and the people can at least get access to water and fuel.

notimagain · 26/10/2023 16:31

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 16:19

@notimagain so you agree? You don’t need to hurry to find a link - any “side” that bombs hospitals, threatens to bomb hospitals or orders hospitals to evacuate is morally wrong.

Nope, you're trying to paint a false equivalence.

The rockets from Gaza are (always have been) indiscriminate, and aimed at the civilian population, I guess given your stand on morals you have complained about "war crimes" about this over the last few decades?, maybe I missed it.

The GC, LOAC, and other conventions have been done to death, and given Oct 7th I think there's precious little moral high ground for Hamas or it's supporters to occupy.

Just a reminder:

https://rocketalert.live/

Rocket Alerts in Israel

Real-time rocket alerts in Israel

https://rocketalert.live

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 16:34

I really question the moral decency on here.

How many children need to die? What’s the number? 3000 children have died in the last 2 weeks. Where do we stop? 4,000? 5,000? 10,000?

Where is the line?

SarahC50 · 26/10/2023 16:36

@notimagain that is horrific the live rocket alert just vile those poor people.

@Sippingmytea exactly where is the line? It seems there is no line and Israel can do what it likes fully supported by the world. I fear for humanity it is all so awful

CosimoPiovasco · 26/10/2023 19:55

This was posted on another thread.
Called : To think this is genocide, thread 2
Hope you can read it, it’s a bit hazy.

To think it’s turning into genocide in real time part 2
CosimoPiovasco · 26/10/2023 19:57

CosimoPiovasco · 26/10/2023 19:55

This was posted on another thread.
Called : To think this is genocide, thread 2
Hope you can read it, it’s a bit hazy.

That was for another post.
Moving on.

Poudretteite · 26/10/2023 20:04

How do you fight an aggressor that has vowed to wipe you off the map and fights exclusively with war crimes? How is all the onus on Israel to avoid what Hamas is deliberately setting up, as horrific as it is? They are shooting a fleeing Gazans and creating a scenario where, in order to destroy them, Israel must cause excessive civilian casualties. It's disgusting and heartbreaking.

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 20:10

“Israel must cause excessive civilian casualties”

Do you realise how crazy that sounds to people? You’re saying Israel is being forced to kill thousands of civilians. Another poster justifying the deaths of thousands of innocent people.

No one is forcing Israel to drop bombs on civilians.

Goldfishonabike · 26/10/2023 20:20

It’s being words awful. It’s all a tragedy and tbh it’s our European colonial history still unfolding it’s nasty traces. Israel should never have been made the way it was and the creation of the country was a recipe for suffering for both Jews and Palestinians, who are now locked in a vicious cycle of death. I understand the fear, aggression and fanatical of many Jews, who were targeted for complete extinction just under 80 years ago. Due to antisemitism, which is a real thing, make no mistake, many Jews support Israel as a sanctuary, the only place they believe they can feel safe, whatever it takes. Even the cost of countless innocent Palestinian lives. It’s a tragedy. I just wish we could get on with a real two-star solution and getJews worldwide to feel safe in the knowledge that other countries are firmly countering any budding antisemitism. And then I’m flabbergasted at the West taking such a strong pro-Israel stance this time and I’m suspecting it’s relayed to Russia-Ukraine.

Everythingnotsavedwillbelost73 · 26/10/2023 20:30

Well this is nice isn’t it- Al Jazeera reporting on a viral trend in Israel taking the piss out of Palestinians for having no water etc - just fucking classy https://twitter.com/ajenglish/status/1717578277777555773?s=12&t=lFU8x26ZvPvK7EneBsSOlA

https://twitter.com/ajenglish/status/1717578277777555773?s=12&t=lFU8x26ZvPvK7EneBsSOlA

OP posts:
Poudretteite · 26/10/2023 20:31

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 20:10

“Israel must cause excessive civilian casualties”

Do you realise how crazy that sounds to people? You’re saying Israel is being forced to kill thousands of civilians. Another poster justifying the deaths of thousands of innocent people.

No one is forcing Israel to drop bombs on civilians.

Edited

So the alternative is to let Hamas continue to cause terror attacks unchecked, raping and burning civilians alive?

Hamas fires rockets from civilian buildings and hides there, and refuses to let Gazans evacuate. So what is the acceptable reaction from your point of view? Allow them to continue to murder?

It is awful that Hamas has started a war and is deliberately causing excessive deaths. What you don't seem to understand is that they are trying to maximise Palestinian deaths because they don't care about them, it looks bad for Israel, and it increases humanitarian aid that they can misuse. That's it. So Hamas wants to force Israel into killing as many as possible while they try to dismantle the threat.

Obviously civilian deaths are awful, but you can't just say Israel can't fight back against genocidal terrorists that haven't returned their hostages and are STILL firing rockets. Do you realise how crazy THAT sounds?

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 20:33

@Everythingnotsavedwillbelost73 that is absolutely vile. Making fun of people who are dying! Where is their humanity?

Sippingmytea · 26/10/2023 20:36

@Poudretteite how many innocent civilians does Israel need to kill before they feel “safe”?

Where is the line?

Everythingnotsavedwillbelost73 · 26/10/2023 20:37

@Sippingmytea I know right- it’s absolutely sick

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