To be haunted by this (Israel/Hamas)

[newstart24]

The second picture, of the little girl sitting on her mother’s (I presume) knee. My DD is a similar age and I can’t get it out of my head. I just hope she got out of the situation and is ok. This country has its problems but bloody hell, when you think what other people in the world are going through, we are all so lucky to live here.

Israel shares horrific October 7 footage as it denies genocide charge

https://mol.im/a/13005021

Every hurt child is an atrocity, regardless of sides.

But I do think a genocide of Palestinians is taking place, and no one really cares.

Awful. You must be even more haunted by the 1000s of poor Gaza’s children and babies maimed and killed by Israel in the months after. Babies dying and women having caesareans with no anaesthetic.

It’s horrendous.

Two wrongs don’t make a right however.

It’s always children that pay the highest price.

You won’t get any good responses on here @newstart24
Mumsnet has been taken over by the Hamas fan club.

But there aren’t photos of them in the Daily Mail!!!1! So how can we possibly sympathise with them???? How can that be as haunting??????

Seriously. Some people.

It’s always children that pay the highest price.

Yes. It’s utterly sickening and I feel so powerless. This is on Hamas IMO - if they hadn’t committed this disgusting attack in the first place then Israel would not have retaliated in the devastating way they did. Hamas attacked and murdered innocent Israelis - including children - knowing full well that a retaliation from Israel and loss of Palestinian lives would be the consequence. They’re also accused of using civilians as human shields. My heart breaks for all the innocent children caught up in this, on both sides. It’s truly hell on earth.

It is appalling. October 7th will be a stain on our collective memories. Never forget.

Never again.

It is absolutely hell on earth that kids - or any people, really - are suffering on both sides. Hamas are militant, yes. I completely understand your horror and I really hope you can hold your kids safe tonight. But I please implore everyone to stop and think about why Hamas even did this, even for a second.

It wasn’t unprovoked - for lack of better words, shit has been going down in the Levant for years and the global west hasn’t mentioned it much (I appreciate that placed like Iraq and Iran took precedence for a while).

Hamas is violent and awful in method. However years and years and years of diplomacy for Palestine has not worked and many Palestinian people have essentially been liquidated into a ghetto, rather than the entire country they were originally allowed to even exist in. Does that sound familiar, especially regarding genocide?

Children shouldn’t ever die from violence. But the IDF response to murder probably shouldn’t be indiscriminate bombing. An eye for an eye makes the whole world go blind.

Agreed OP it's awful and heartbreaking. Awful Israel has to share these images to be believed also.

#Metoounlessyoureajew.

Wow - what a sickening post. 1,200 innocent Israelis murdered, including children - and you call evidence of that “propaganda”? Anyone who can look at that poor innocent family and not feel utter despair and sadness is not human in my eyes.

And 17, 747 innocent Palestinians murdered, including children by Israel.

Anyone who can look at that number of murdered people and not feel utter despair and sadness is not human in my eyes.

You clearly missed my post above, where I said this:

“My heart breaks for all the innocent children caught up in this, on both sides. It’s truly hell on earth.”

I just happened to see that terrified little girl’s face tonight and it really upset me. Like I say, I really hope she’s ok.

then suddenly a very ‘normal’ British person is of the opinion Israel should nuke Gaza or something equally ridiculous.

Where have I said that Israel should nuke Gaza? I was actually going to say please don’t put words into my mouth, but actually, how dare you.

could be easily won over by media trickery.

Media trickery - sorry, what do you mean by that exactly? I hope you have a good explanation because on the surface, that sounds like an extremely offensive thing to say.

Hi, so I’ve been in this thread a lot talking about how the senseless murder of children - Palestinian or Israeli - is wrong.

I’m also a Jew - my family took refuge in the UK after the Second World War.

I think Jews do matter. I think we matter a lot and the fight against anti-Semitism is important. I think the difference between the words Jew / Israeli / Zionist is important. I would never support the actions of the IDF in my life because I consider them to be acting on a false pretence, but people like you tend to conveniently exclude the many Jews who have openly said that Palestine is suffering horrendously.

Never again is now. And that includes Zionists committing genocide against Palastinians. Israel is committing genocide in the name of a religious freedom granted by checks notes Winston Churchill? What? Just fyi, the reason Orthodox Jews never move to Israel is because there hasn’t yet been a true messiah who says they (and other Jews who believe that) can live there.

I don’t even know if you’re Jewish or not, but either way: sei gesunt.

YANBU OP. I am haunted by every image. By every testimony.

The rape victims.
The bereaved parents.
The orphaned children.
The families of the hostages.
The aid workers.
The medical staff.
The homeless.
The starving.
The journalists.

Each and every victim.

rape and stealing babies is not resistance.

there are a number of legitimate criticisms of Netanyahu- but come one on - a Hamas and the “Palestinian cause” is horrific. Beyond awful. They attacked Israel in the most horrific way imaginable and their internal regime in Gaza is horrific. They are totally and utterly failing to look after their own people.

Anyone not singing from the Israeli propaganda hymn sheet is offensive to you.

I don’t think anyone said that Israel (were they even a nuclear state, as they have not even confirmed that) should nuke Gaza. I think the point was that Israel nuking Gaza would be incomprehensibly bad - come on, this is a heated discussion, the use of metaphor is expected.

In fact, the statement ALREADY precluded that idea: it said ‘or something else’ - typically ‘or’ means only one of the options are available.

Nobody was suggesting anyone should be nuked. That’s clearly ridiculous. The point was clearly to suggest something as drastic as a nuke in familiar conversation.

Come on, don’t derail genuine discussion because of upset over linguistics.

Nicely said.

Had Hamas attacked and targeted Government buildings, people just might understand why they felt they had to do something to bring the situation of the Palestinians to the attention of other countries. But, for you to justify the murders and rapes and tortures of young people at a musical festival as suitable and appropriate retaliation is awful. Stop being an apologist for these evil terrorists. Israel absolutely have the right to attack Hamas and protect their people.

Watch the footage of Israelis killing a Palestinian man waving a white flag for peace and then try and claim Israelis aren’t murdering indiscriminately.

It’s all on camera.

…does it? Why does it sound offensive?

Here we have a Guardian article in which Israelis
are ‘murdered’ and Palestinians ‘die’ (even though, if killed by the IDF, it is a war crime).

And here we have another in which Palestinians ‘dehydrate to death’ as if that’s normal in a place that does indeed have running water. Would you like to guess what country turned the running water off?

Here, the Times notes that “Hamas killed 1,400 people … and 10,300 Palestinians are said to have died”. Did those Palestinians spontaneously die, do you think?

Do you not consider it media trickery for them to say ‘X Israelis were killed’ and ‘Y Palestinians died’? That is deliberate language choice to change the focus of attention from the dead to the killer.