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To let my dd take this to school

204 replies

flightofthesevenmillionbumblebees · 10/07/2022 21:11

Dd (10) loves stranger things and this w/e bought herself a hellfire club water bottle. She goes to a Christian school. The bottle says hellfire club and has an image of the devils head (as in the programme).

Aibu to let her use this water bottle as her school water bottle?? We are not a religious family and I personally think that this is just something from a tv programme (that is not in anyway about devil worshipping or anything actually related to the devil or religion - under those circumstances I might consider it insulting to Christians), and really is no different to her taking in a water bottle that's Harry Potter themed, or Star Wars etc.

The reason I'm even asking is because a couple of weeks ago dd made up this game where she draws the devil and gives him a 'health bar' like in a video game, and she asks you to think of things that might hurt him (e.g being hit by a car, throwing a spear at him, force feeding him cupcakes, being sat on by a giant panda - I've enjoyed the more inventive funny ones) and the health bar goes down until you kill him.

Just a silly thing she thought of and was doing in her notebook at some point during lunch break. Her teacher 'told her off' (I'm not sure how firmly it was said) and basically said it wasn't appropriate to be drawing a devil at a Christian school. So I'm thinking her teacher might also think it inappropriate to have this water bottle.

I personally don't see anything wrong with her having this water bottle (or the game!) and I'm happy to let her take it in tomorrow. But if her teacher tells her she can't have it then aibu to argue this with the teacher or should I just let it go and tell dd she can't take it in?

(Also apologies I'm using talk app so can't enable voting I don't think)

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bro101 · 11/07/2022 14:44

Stranger Things is fine for a 10 year old if they don't scare easily. My dd watched from 8. She loves horror movies. I wouldn't take the bottle though.

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2bazookas · 11/07/2022 14:50

If you went to a teetotal home, would you expect them to provide booze for you? Or tolerate you bringing your own? If the hosts don't eat meat or pork, would you take your own ham sandwich ? Wouldnt that be rude, thoughtless, provocative?

You signed up your DD to be educated in a certain ethical framework. You both know where the boundary is because you've already been told.

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NumberTheory · 11/07/2022 14:51

I think a teacher who objects to a game where the object is to kill the devil is likely to object to a water bottle with a Hellfire club logo. I think letting your DD make the decision was the right way to go. I fully support your approach in encouraging her to to consider other people but also herself and what she wants and not to always put herself at the bottom of the list of people to please.

I don't think the objection to the teacher's game was well founded unless the imagery was particularly scary. The premise of your DD's game wasn't critical of anyone's belief and could even be considered in keeping with the Christian faith. But I do think schools can reasonably object to imagery associated with a TV program rated older than any child at the school or with imagery that many younger children at the school might find scary (which I think applies to the Hellfire club logo).

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NumberTheory · 11/07/2022 14:53

GladAllOver · 11/07/2022 13:24

Letting young children watch adult material is denying them part of their childhood, when they could be enjoy childish things.
Let them grow up at a normal pace and deal with the adult world when they need to.

Watching some adult programs doesn't stop a kid from also doing childish things.

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cecilthehungryspider · 11/07/2022 15:03

CoastalWave · 11/07/2022 13:23

Have you actually watched it? It's a bit like how Young Sheldon is rated 15. Both of them are absolutely fine to watch with younger than 15, as it all depends on the child.

No hardcore sex (in fact, other than Nancy and Steve getting it on in Series 1, which was all implied by the way, not shown, I can't even think of any sex in it) - very little bad language (which given they're dealing with monsters is impressive!) . Main theme is friendship and teamwork imo. The upside down is a world where monsters live. Yes, the child killing scene in the lab in Series 4 isn't appropriate for a younger child to watch so sensible parents would just say, let's skip that bit.

My children both say it's about friendship and beating a baddy. It's hardly Nightmare on Elm Street! It's more ET! It's not psychological in the slightest and clearly about a MADE UP LAND. No drugs. Children are polite to their parents and teachers.

I think people need to chill out. Or else you'll end up like the parents of a friend of mine at school who wasn't allowed to watch Grange Hill. Apparently it wasn't appropriate for a 15/16 yr old to watch. Guess which 18 yr old went off the rails at uni sleeping around and doing drugs? It certainly wasn't me and my parents let me watch pretty much anything.

Yes, there are drugs! In this last season. Chrissy is scoring drugs off Eddie Munson, not to mention the stoner driving the pizza van!

That said, the reason my 10 yr old doesn't get to watch it is because of the horrific brutal killings...

Mumsnet is weird. People get admonished for letting young children read Harry Potter but watching Stanger Things is fine?!

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WitchWithoutChips · 11/07/2022 15:09

CoastalWave · 11/07/2022 13:23

Have you actually watched it? It's a bit like how Young Sheldon is rated 15. Both of them are absolutely fine to watch with younger than 15, as it all depends on the child.

No hardcore sex (in fact, other than Nancy and Steve getting it on in Series 1, which was all implied by the way, not shown, I can't even think of any sex in it) - very little bad language (which given they're dealing with monsters is impressive!) . Main theme is friendship and teamwork imo. The upside down is a world where monsters live. Yes, the child killing scene in the lab in Series 4 isn't appropriate for a younger child to watch so sensible parents would just say, let's skip that bit.

My children both say it's about friendship and beating a baddy. It's hardly Nightmare on Elm Street! It's more ET! It's not psychological in the slightest and clearly about a MADE UP LAND. No drugs. Children are polite to their parents and teachers.

I think people need to chill out. Or else you'll end up like the parents of a friend of mine at school who wasn't allowed to watch Grange Hill. Apparently it wasn't appropriate for a 15/16 yr old to watch. Guess which 18 yr old went off the rails at uni sleeping around and doing drugs? It certainly wasn't me and my parents let me watch pretty much anything.

You might want to read the BBFC’s evaluation of S3 before making such glib statements: www.bbfc.co.uk/education/case-studies/stranger-things-season-3. I anticipate some episodes of S4 will be rated 18 for graphic violence once the BBFC classifies them.

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ChiefWiggumsBoy · 11/07/2022 15:28

@CoastalWave did you watch S4? It’s far scarier than any of the other series. And quite similar to Nightmare on Elm Street - not sure that kids being attacked by a ‘real’ entity in their dreams is much different to kids being attacked by a ‘real’ entity while in a trance is actually too different considering what actually happens to them Hmm

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EveryFlightBeginsWithAFall · 11/07/2022 15:37

ChiefWiggumsBoy · 11/07/2022 15:28

@CoastalWave did you watch S4? It’s far scarier than any of the other series. And quite similar to Nightmare on Elm Street - not sure that kids being attacked by a ‘real’ entity in their dreams is much different to kids being attacked by a ‘real’ entity while in a trance is actually too different considering what actually happens to them Hmm

Yeah it has lots of nods to nightmare on elm Street in season 4, amusing to adults because Robert England's in it.

First episode of season 4 was probably the most scary, I wouldn't say the rest of it was though

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zingally · 11/07/2022 16:51

No. It's not appropriate for a primary school, much less one with a Christian ethos.

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Anxiernie · 11/07/2022 17:04

We, and they, won't be thinking about real Evil, where tiny babies and small children are raped, and that the rapes are filmed so that thousands of other people (usually men) can enjoy and get off on watching them.

I can't say I've ever thought about that when watching Stranger Things either.

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Supergirl1958 · 11/07/2022 17:28

CoastalWave · 11/07/2022 13:23

Have you actually watched it? It's a bit like how Young Sheldon is rated 15. Both of them are absolutely fine to watch with younger than 15, as it all depends on the child.

No hardcore sex (in fact, other than Nancy and Steve getting it on in Series 1, which was all implied by the way, not shown, I can't even think of any sex in it) - very little bad language (which given they're dealing with monsters is impressive!) . Main theme is friendship and teamwork imo. The upside down is a world where monsters live. Yes, the child killing scene in the lab in Series 4 isn't appropriate for a younger child to watch so sensible parents would just say, let's skip that bit.

My children both say it's about friendship and beating a baddy. It's hardly Nightmare on Elm Street! It's more ET! It's not psychological in the slightest and clearly about a MADE UP LAND. No drugs. Children are polite to their parents and teachers.

I think people need to chill out. Or else you'll end up like the parents of a friend of mine at school who wasn't allowed to watch Grange Hill. Apparently it wasn't appropriate for a 15/16 yr old to watch. Guess which 18 yr old went off the rails at uni sleeping around and doing drugs? It certainly wasn't me and my parents let me watch pretty much anything.

Seriously? Series 4 was pretty gruesome, even i had nightmares and I'm 35!

And are you really comparing young sheldon to stranger things, where drugs, gruesome deaths and the paranormal were the order of the day?

The ratings are given based on a number of things. There is also violence in the extreme, a baby being burned alive and gunfire in the latest series.

Not appropriate at all for a ten year old!!!

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TheLadyofShalott1 · 11/07/2022 17:31

@flightofthesevenmillionbumblebees
I absolutely agree with your well thought out and presented ethos on the way you want to bring up your child, and I do believe that the subject of autonomy would be a hill worthy of you dying on, but I sincerely hope and expect that to not be necessary. However, the pp who suggested that your DD should not die on that hill over a water bottle is also absolutely correct in my opinion - it is not a hill for you to die on either OP, but hopefully you already know that!

But as others have already said, or alluded to, you should maybe re-asses when, and how, you choose to teach, and/or encourage, your DD into understanding about autonomy. As important as it is - as stated in Wikipedia, but acknowledged as being said by David Shaffer

"in adolescence the most important developmental task is to develop a healthy sense of autonomy"

even learning about, and utilizing our own autonomy, needs to go hand in hand with with appropriateness and common sense. I agree with the other pp's here that don't think an argument over any water bottle, but particularly one that would most likely be considered offensive by a hosting party, or scary for other users of the same benefit, in this case the school and it's pupils, is in any way appropriate or useful for you or your DD.
Therefore, I am glad that it wasn't taken into school today, but I don't think on this occasion that it should have been up to your DD to make that decision. I think that you, as the adult, should have made that decision, and then you could have told her afterwards why it wasn't appropriate to take that bottle, into that school.

May I also add here that I know the Cof E Church School was not one of your preferred choices for your DD, but it might be useful to remember that it wasn't their choice to offer your child a place either.

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WifeMotherWorkRepeat · 11/07/2022 17:36

I’m another that thinks allowing a 10 year old to watch Stranger Things is outrageously inappropriate! OP you may have watched the very first scene setting episode but having just finished the 3rd series last night I can tell you it’s violent and not something a 10 year old should be exposed to.
Also, sending your DD to her Christian school with a devil water bottle is very provocative!!

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MrsKeats · 11/07/2022 17:47

Letting a 10 year old watch that show is dreadful.
And the water bottle question just underlines your lack of judgement.

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gogohmm · 11/07/2022 17:58

@CoastalWave

Yes I've watched it and it's not suitable for children. The supernatural element alone is enough for it to get a15 then there's the violence. We haven't watched the latest series because I don't like scary thingsConfused

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StinkyWizzleteets · 11/07/2022 18:12

There aren’t enough pearls in the world for this thread 😂😂

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EveryFlightBeginsWithAFall · 11/07/2022 18:20

StinkyWizzleteets · 11/07/2022 18:12

There aren’t enough pearls in the world for this thread 😂😂

It's odd because I read a thread the other week and there were loads of parents saying their 10 year olds had watched it and no pearl clutching in sight

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Johnnysgirl · 11/07/2022 18:23

Will you with the pearl clutching nonsense? Nobody is doing any such thing when they say they wouldn't let a 10 year old watch that show or take that bottle to school.
It's hardly a niche viewpoint.

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5128gap · 11/07/2022 18:24

No. You chose a school with a set of beliefs and values. It would be rude and inappropriate to do something that offends people who take them seriously.
I'm not religious BTW.

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RainCoffeeBook · 11/07/2022 18:36

I think you'll be judged far more for letting a young child watch an adult-rated violent show.

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RainCoffeeBook · 11/07/2022 18:38

I don't remember people being graphically tortured with broken bones and eyeballs torn from their heads in ET, but then there'll always be parents who know fuck all about what their kids are watching or think modern episodes are 'just like that bit I saw in season 1'.

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Johnnysgirl · 11/07/2022 19:02

RainCoffeeBook · 11/07/2022 18:38

I don't remember people being graphically tortured with broken bones and eyeballs torn from their heads in ET, but then there'll always be parents who know fuck all about what their kids are watching or think modern episodes are 'just like that bit I saw in season 1'.

Yes, I had to laugh at the "it's basically ET!" post 😂
Unreal.

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rainbowmilk · 11/07/2022 19:04

I can’t believe we’re 8 pages in and nobody has brought up the supersoaker thread…

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Johnnysgirl · 11/07/2022 19:05

rainbowmilk · 11/07/2022 19:04

I can’t believe we’re 8 pages in and nobody has brought up the supersoaker thread…

Why would they?

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ThanksItHasPockets · 11/07/2022 19:39

Maybe @CoastalWave could go back and re-watch episode 1 of season 4. Spoilers ahead if you haven’t seen it.

In the first fifteen minutes there is a flashback to a massacre in a laboratory. Dozens of bodies, mostly children’s, are lying in pools of blood. One survivor is bleeding from her eyes. The gore is not lingered upon so let’s say that this would probably pass at a 15 certificate.

In the last ten minutes a high school student has gone to another student’s home to buy ketamine. While she is there she is brutally murdered by a demon in a parallel world. Trapped in a nightmarish version of her house she sees her father with his eyes and mouth sewn shut before being attacked by the demon. In the real world her body is in a trance. She is lifted from the floor and slammed into the ceiling. The camera then focuses on each of her limbs in turn as they are graphically snapped and broken into grotesque shapes. Finally the camera settles on her face and shows her eyes falling from the sockets.

I absolutely love Stranger Things. Both of
these gruesome scenes are essential to the plot and skipping them completely defeats the point of watching the show. If you have to skip them to make it suitable for your child then maybe, just maybe, it is not appropriate for them.

But y’know, the kids are polite to the adults so it’s fine Hmm (and frankly this is selective too. Dustin is awful to his mother. El is incredibly rude to Hopper in S3. Maybe you’re thinking of Billy attempting to seduce Mike and Nancy’s mum. He was certainly nice to her then.)

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