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Original poster

Gifting non-vegan art to a vegan friend

202 replies

forinborin · 15/12/2021 11:28

A ridiculous first world problem of today.

And the problem is that I commissioned a painting for one of my old dear friends as a Christmas present and just realised now that the artist uses quite a lot of animal-derived products in their work (ox gall as a primer, sable/squirrel brushes, things like that). Realised after watching some video tutorials of the said artist.

The friend is long-term vegetarian, turned vegan around a year ago. Quite strict about it (not in a proselytising way, but all close people know).

Would it be ethically ok to still give it to her? Or would it be below the "tolerance" level? Or do I ask her first if she is ok with it (it was intended as a surprise, so this will ruin it in a sense)? I feel so stupid now for not checking, but it is not something that occurred to me at all.

OP posts:
Stompythedinosaur · 15/12/2021 11:33

If you had realised in advance I obviously wouldn't have ordered it, but if it is already done then I'd be tempted to give it.

Original poster
forinborin · 15/12/2021 11:34

@Stompythedinosaur

If you had realised in advance I obviously wouldn't have ordered it, but if it is already done then I'd be tempted to give it.
Already done, delivered (to me), paid for and it is beautiful (and very meaningful to her).
OP posts:
BestZebbie · 15/12/2021 11:36

I think I'd also give it, but explain and apologise.
I definitely wouldn't give her something made of leather, fur or feathers though, so I'm not sure why the painting feels different - especially because I also don't think it would be ok to give haribo with gelatine or non-vegan wine as well as avoiding obvious meat/milk etc.

BatshitBanshee · 15/12/2021 11:36

I'd give it. It's already done and it's not like you're gifting her a steak.

HangingOutWithTheSandman · 15/12/2021 11:40

As a vegan, I wouldn’t want it. Sorry. You could ask her, but don’t be offended if she says no.

MorningStarling · 15/12/2021 11:40

She's not going to eat it so I think it's fine to give it to her. I am not a vegan and would have zero problem with being given a piece of art that had no animal-based products in it - I wouldn't even think about it to be honest.

If she objects then reconsider whether she's deserving of a gift anyway.

HangingOutWithTheSandman · 15/12/2021 11:41

I am not a vegan and would have zero problem with being given a piece of art that had no animal-based products in it - I wouldn't even think about it to be honest.

Confused
Robostripes · 15/12/2021 11:43

If you take veganism to this level you wouldn’t be able to buy anything. Every single thing you buy will have been manufactured by people wearing leather shoes, who drove to the factory in vehicles with leather seats etc …

I’d give it to her and not say anything.

Original poster
forinborin · 15/12/2021 11:43

@HangingOutWithTheSandman

As a vegan, I wouldn’t want it. Sorry. You could ask her, but don’t be offended if she says no.
I understand, and thank you for your opinion. It genuinely did not occur to me before, I know how thick that sounds but it wasn't even on my radar to check.
OP posts:
DropYourSword · 15/12/2021 11:44

@MorningStarling

She's not going to eat it so I think it's fine to give it to her. I am not a vegan and would have zero problem with being given a piece of art that had no animal-based products in it - I wouldn't even think about it to be honest.

If she objects then reconsider whether she's deserving of a gift anyway.

She wouldn’t eat leather shoes either, but you wouldn’t give her those!
NynaeveSedai · 15/12/2021 11:46

What is ox gall?
Does the painting contain actual animal bits or were they just used in the process?
As a vegan I would say if only used in the process don't tell her but if the painting actually includes animal derivatives then no.

trumpisagit · 15/12/2021 11:46

I am a vegan (and lifelong vegetarian). It wouldn't occur to me to check re art.
Definitely give it to her, and don't mention the production issues (I wouldn't want to know).
You sound very generous, but I think you are over thinking it.

NynaeveSedai · 15/12/2021 11:46

@MorningStarling

She's not going to eat it so I think it's fine to give it to her. I am not a vegan and would have zero problem with being given a piece of art that had no animal-based products in it - I wouldn't even think about it to be honest.

If she objects then reconsider whether she's deserving of a gift anyway.

What on Earth do you think your feelings about things that don't contain animal products have to do with anything here?
Original poster
forinborin · 15/12/2021 11:47

@Robostripes

If you take veganism to this level you wouldn’t be able to buy anything. Every single thing you buy will have been manufactured by people wearing leather shoes, who drove to the factory in vehicles with leather seats etc …

I’d give it to her and not say anything.

On one hand, yes. On another, here the gift itself will have animal-derived products. It will unfortunately be quite easy for her to discover that, all tutorials of the artist start with how he prefers natural origin materials / binders / pigments to synthetic (when he goes through what he is going to use).
OP posts:
JudyJudyJudyDench · 15/12/2021 11:48

It all depends on her outlook
I've been vegan for about 20 years but would rather accept and live this gift than it go to waste
But then I still by leather shoes (second hand) and would more than likely drink a tea made in error with milk rather than waste it to make another x
Waste is a huge issue for our world

BobbieT1999 · 15/12/2021 11:48

@trumpisagit

I am a vegan (and lifelong vegetarian). It wouldn't occur to me to check re art. Definitely give it to her, and don't mention the production issues (I wouldn't want to know). You sound very generous, but I think you are over thinking it.
Agree completely.
Original poster
forinborin · 15/12/2021 11:49

@NynaeveSedai

What is ox gall? Does the painting contain actual animal bits or were they just used in the process? As a vegan I would say if only used in the process don't tell her but if the painting actually includes animal derivatives then no.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ox_gall

used as an ingredient to loosen watercolour paint, if I understand correctly.

OP posts:
EssexLioness · 15/12/2021 11:50

I am vegan and it wouldn’t occur to me to check about the brushes tbh but the ox gall would be a definite no from me. You are a very thoughtful friend to consider this. It is amazing how often vegans encounter stupid comments like the above ‘she’s not going to eat it.’ Just explain to your friend and see what she says. She will probably be very grateful that you are being so considerate and respectful of her beliefs

Cattenberg · 15/12/2021 11:51

I’m vegetarian and I agree too @trumpisagit.

NynaeveSedai · 15/12/2021 11:52

I'm afraid in that case I wouldn't want it. I'm sorry but it would gross me out hugely to have a piece of art in my house that contained actual animal derivatives. You could not tell her of course but it's up to you how it would sit with you. Everyone is different though and maybe if you explain and offer her sincerely to keep the painting yourself if she isn't comfortable then she may want it anyway.

peachgreen · 15/12/2021 11:52

@MorningStarling

She's not going to eat it so I think it's fine to give it to her. I am not a vegan and would have zero problem with being given a piece of art that had no animal-based products in it - I wouldn't even think about it to be honest.

If she objects then reconsider whether she's deserving of a gift anyway.

Possibly the most ridiculous comment I've ever read on MN and that's saying something.

I think you probably do have to say something, OP - I'm sorry. But if I was your friend I would like you even more for being thoughtful enough to do so.

HangingOutWithTheSandman · 15/12/2021 11:52

I understand, and thank you for your opinion. It genuinely did not occur to me before, I know how thick that sounds but it wasn't even on my radar to check.

It was a lovely thought and you sound like a lovely friend. And she may be ok with it if you ask her. I reluctantly buy my kids various things that are not vegan. They have trainers, leather chairs etc. I just don’t buy those things for myself. I have vegan friends who don’t allow anything in their house. See what her thinking is.

And it doesn’t sound thick at all. When I was first a vegan, I couldn’t believe the amount of things that had animal products in, so if you’re not a vegan, it’s understandable that it wouldn’t occur to you.

Do you like the painting yourself? Would it look good in your house? 🤣

Earwigworries · 15/12/2021 11:55

If she is a good enough friend to have you do this for her then I think you should probably show her and explain the issue . It’s up to her whether she wants to keep it but at least she will know the efforts you went to for her

Original poster
forinborin · 15/12/2021 11:57

Do you like the painting yourself? Would it look good in your house?
I am amazed by the painting, to be fair, it is beautiful. This is exactly why I nosed around the artist's channel, to see how the magic happens.

The problem is that it is of something that is very specific to her (say, a dead relative's portrait - it is absolutely not that I hasten to add, but just to highlight how personal it is - and I definitely know she'd love it, I know her for 30+ years).

OP posts:
Chocolatewheatos · 15/12/2021 11:57

It would never even occur to me to check re art, I was vegetarian then vegan for years.

Could you ask her without telling her "I was just wondering re your veganism, do you check art to know if it was made with animal paints and brushes?"