Gifting non-vegan art to a vegan friend

[forinborin]

A ridiculous first world problem of today.

And the problem is that I commissioned a painting for one of my old dear friends as a Christmas present and just realised now that the artist uses quite a lot of animal-derived products in their work (ox gall as a primer, sable/squirrel brushes, things like that). Realised after watching some video tutorials of the said artist.

The friend is long-term vegetarian, turned vegan around a year ago. Quite strict about it (not in a proselytising way, but all close people know).

Would it be ethically ok to still give it to her? Or would it be below the "tolerance" level? Or do I ask her first if she is ok with it (it was intended as a surprise, so this will ruin it in a sense)? I feel so stupid now for not checking, but it is not something that occurred to me at all.

[forinborin]

@AnotherMansCause

If she gets upset about it containing animal products, would she also get upset about her polyester clothing releasing microplastics into the water courses, into the sea, & harming oceanic wildlife by contributing to loss of biodiversity? Does she only wear organic cotton? The pesticides & chemicals they use for conventional cotton production are exceedingly unpleasant for the environment & wildlife. It depends how strict she is about her vegan ethics.

I'm vegan BTW. Personally if I were you, I just wouldn't tell her.

She's not the proselytising type as I said, but I know (by osmosis of knowledge over decades rather than being explicitly told) that she's quite strict. And her work and research revolves around sustainability too, so she's definitely more informed than me on the topic.

My issue is that I respect her beliefs, and I am cursing now myself for checking it out but I cannot really unsee it and pretend I know nothing. Offloading the decision to her - "here's something you'd love, but unfortunately it is painted with dead animals' bodily fluids because I did not bother to check" also seems like cowardice.

[AndSoFinally]

Tough one.

I think I'd go down the route of not telling her. If you've commissioned it you could even downright lie and say the artist used synthetic products. That's probably taking it too far, but you could.

There has to be a line for veganism though. Nothing is really completely vegan. Even vegetables are grown using blood and bonemeal fertilisers (unless you grow everything yourself). It just depends where your friend's line is.

[ABCeasyasdohrayme]

Contact the artist first and double check what they used, it may not be an issue at all.

[forinborin]

@ABCeasyasdohrayme

Contact the artist first and double check what they used, it may not be an issue at all.

It is an issue unfortunately, checked already.

[gogohm]

I would just give it to her, if you hadn't watched the tutorials you wouldn't have known

[TheShoeLady]

I’m an artist and it wouldn’t occur to me to check whether art was vegan or not! But then I’m a cheapskate and use artificial brushes etc.

I agree with the idea of testing the waters by saying you didn’t check before you commissioned it and that it’s beautiful but if she doesn’t like the idea of sable brushes being used you totally understand.

Slightly missing the point re production methods - but if she loves the picture but wouldn’t want the ox fall in her house could she make a high quality print of it instead?

[muddyford]

Just wrap it up and give it to her.

[HangingOutWithTheSandman]

Offloading the decision to her - "here's something you'd love, but unfortunately it is painted with dead animals' bodily fluids because I did not bother to check" also seems like cowardice.

I would word it, ‘I had something very personal made for you and only after, did I find out that it contains animal products. I just didn’t think as they’re not obvious animal products and now I don’t know what to do. So, I’m telling you because I driven myself mad with it and I’m kicking myself not to have realised sooner. I don’t expect you to want the present, but I would love for you to see it anyway, so you know the thought was there’

You’ve then taken away any feeling of obligation for her to have it, but she may step in and say she would still like to have it.

[moose62]

I would be honest with her and say that you understand perfectly if she cant take it and in which case you will keep it for yourself.

[FlipFlops4Me]

As a vegan the ox-gall would be the deal-breaker for me. It's unfortunate but you are very kind in considering your friend's principles this way. If she is given a chance to think about it she might find that done's done and can't be undone, if you see what I mean.

I search (sometimes for a long time) to find vegan versions of things I want and if a vegan version can't be found then my attitude is that I'd rather do without. I think I'd have to say the same about the ox-gall.

[Namenic]

I’m not vegan, but I can see how some vegans might be uncomfortable. I think you should tell her what happened like you have on here and explain. Say that you understand if she couldn’t accept it - perhaps keep it in your house as a token of your friendship. If I were your friend I’d be honoured that you had been thoughtful but also respectful of my beliefs.

[godmum56]

I think you have to ask....how "far" people take their eithical views is such a personal thing.

[HangingOutWithTheSandman]

If I were your friend I’d be honoured that you had been thoughtful but also respectful of my beliefs.

Absolutely.

[LadyFlumpalot]

You've known her for thirty years, and you know her well enough to have had a personal gift commissioned for her. I guess you probably know her well enough to have a chat with her. Just a simple "I may have screwed up, I had a present commissioned for you, but after I took delivery I realised that the creator uses animal products in the making, would you like it still? Not an issue if you don't"

[MzHz]

Honestly just give it to her, it's the thought that counts. Don't bring it up. YOU have not done anything wrong, neither has the artist, it's just the (traditional) way that artist works.

IF your friend does her research then SHE can make the decision to do something about it. Or not. It's her choice.

Your intentions are beyond reproach here, and THAT is the gift you are giving her.

[strawberrymilk7]

I don't think I'd tell her. Give her the painting, she will hopefully never find out. If she does say you didn't know (which you didn't at time of commission). It may be a painting she will get great pleasure out of, it's made now so nothing to do be done about it. It really is not something I would have even considered looking up if I was purchasing something for a vegan friend.

[forinborin]

@HangingOutWithTheSandman

Offloading the decision to her - "here's something you'd love, but unfortunately it is painted with dead animals' bodily fluids because I did not bother to check" also seems like cowardice.

I would word it, ‘I had something very personal made for you and only after, did I find out that it contains animal products. I just didn’t think as they’re not obvious animal products and now I don’t know what to do. So, I’m telling you because I driven myself mad with it and I’m kicking myself not to have realised sooner. I don’t expect you to want the present, but I would love for you to see it anyway, so you know the thought was there’

You’ve then taken away any feeling of obligation for her to have it, but she may step in and say she would still like to have it.

This is gold. Thanks - this definitely will be the approach I am going to take.

[Fendibby]

I’m vegan and honestly I don’t think I’d even question if it was vegan or not as long as it didn’t have pieces of leather clipped to it or something like that, in which case I would decline the gift.

[ClawedButler]

@AlexaShutUp

In your position, I think I would explain that I had commissioned a gift that had already been made and couldn't be returned, and that I had only realised afterwards that it wasn't suitable for vegans. I would make it clear that I couldn't give it to anyone else, assuming that's the case. Then ask what she'd like me to do with it.

I think that's probably the way to go, although I'd say "wouldn't" rather than "couldn't" otherwise it's putting pressure on her to accept it.

I'm a vegan and while the brushes used to create the picture wouldn't bother me too much, the object itself actually containing ox gall would really put me off.

[ClawedButler]

Or front it out and say pointedly, "You'd have to have a lot of GALL to turn down this painting!"

[Chocaholic9]

In my experience vegans can be evangelical and she may be upset by it. I would explain what had happened and see what she says and if she still wants it but say you understand if she doesn't.

[forinborin]

@Fendibby

I’m vegan and honestly I don’t think I’d even question if it was vegan or not as long as it didn’t have pieces of leather clipped to it or something like that, in which case I would decline the gift.

I don't think she'd question it, but to me it is akin to me cooking a dinner for her - then accidentally realising that I added, say, gelatine to the dessert - and then saying - "nah, she won't know anyway, it is not like she's taking it to a lab".

(as you can imagine, gelatine being derived from animals was another discovery many years ago - I fessed up at that time)

[TheOccupier]

Just give it to her and tell her it's vegan. It's not like she's going to eat it.

[SirVixofVixHall]

It would never have occurred to me to check origin of paints, and as to brushes, well almost all artists would be using natural brushes so that seems totally irrelevant to me, surely that artist doesn’t also need to be a strict vegan ?
The painting has been done now, you had it done unknowingly , so I would either give it and explain that you didn’t know about the possible derivatives in the paint, or give it and not mention it, as it already exists. You can’t even be sure what he used. I am vegetarian, not vegan, but I have old paintings in my house and they will have canvas that has been sized, I used canvases myself in art college that had been pre-sized as they had been done already. (Size is a coating for the canvas made from rabbit skin).

[AlexaShutUp]

@TheOccupier

Just give it to her and tell her it's vegan. It's not like she's going to eat it.

That's so disrespectful. I'm not a vegan myself but can't imagine having so little regard for the ethical choices made by my friends.

Thankfully, it seems like the OP is not so dismissive of others' choices. The friend needs to be able to make an informed decision on whether or not to accept the gift.