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Strong words from feminists unhappy with trans exclusionary ideology..

(375 Posts)
crispbuttyfan Wed 23-May-18 18:57:46

a little taster of the content, not my words....

"We are disgusted by the TERF techniques of bullying trans people and their friends and comrades. TERFs stand against a vulnerable minority by refusing their right to exist, using their dead names, doxxing them, smearing them online and in the press and waging a fear campaign, all whilst accusing trans women of being a possible legal and physical threat to cis women. These techniques are not consistent with their announced aim of getting legislation refused by parliament and belie the TERFs real agenda of intolerance.

We are sick and tired of TERF alarmism. There is no evidence that trans women are in any way a threat to cis women. To the contrary, there is a lot of evidence that TERFs feed the prejudice against trans women. The countries which introduced their own versions of GRA are not experiencing the problems the TERFs associate with allowing trans people to determine their own gender."

Nibledbyducks Wed 23-May-18 18:59:37

shhh nobody mention Mexico!

Pratchet Wed 23-May-18 19:01:55

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

MyAuntyBadger Wed 23-May-18 19:06:59

That first paragraph is what TA's are doing to gender critical women. Do you have any evidence for the other way round?

SeekEveryEveryKnownHidingPlace Wed 23-May-18 19:08:48

Don't use the word 'feminist' to describe people who write shit like this and use the sexist word 'cis'

LangCleg Wed 23-May-18 19:11:18

That our gender and therefore our roles in society are determined by biology is a sexist idea that we have spent our lives rejecting.

How do you even get to be this stupid? Everything is always exactly the opposite of what they think it is. Don't these silly people understand that the only reason their lives have been as comfortable as they have is because of the protections they're determined to liquidate?

MyAuntyBadger Wed 23-May-18 19:15:12

Just saw Tara Wolf's name in the list of signatures. Hahaha, 'feminists' - what a farce.

bd67th Wed 23-May-18 19:16:21

"TERFs stand against a vulnerable minority by refusing their right to exist,"

No, TRAs are the ones saying "kill TERFs, punch TERFs, die cis scum" etc and telling us to "enjoy our erasure". That's all classic TRA darvo.

"using their dead names,"

Aka legal names.

"doxxing them,"


"smearing them online and in the press and waging a fear campaign,"

No, that's what they are doing to us, including with this letter.

"all whilst accusing trans women of being a possible legal and physical threat to cis women."

Speakers Corner attack was a TRA attacking a woman. The "choke on my dick" and "I want to fuck up some TERFs" all show that TRAs are a physical threat to women.

That whole letter is pure DARVO.

Yambabe Wed 23-May-18 19:17:26

I'm still yet to see anyone, anywhere, so-called TERF or bigot, left or right wing, male or female or whatever, refuse or deny trans women's right to exist.

Even on twitter, where all the weirdos hang out. Even on 4chan (shudder) where I've only been once and don't intend going again.

I know we have quite a few trans people and trans allies on here now.

Can any of you show me proof that ANYONE has this attitude?

I've spoken to some of my trans friends. They face some ridicule (mostly from men), some hostility (mostly from men) and occasionally threats of violence (mostly from men). But other than issues faced by anyone who is a bit "different" there doesn't seem to be a concerted plan to wipe them out. No-one has told them to die in a fire, although a couple of them have been called truscum. Not by women.

Where are these TERFS who want to erase trans women? Stating that they are biologically male isn't denying them existence, they are still here, still trans women.

I've not seen anyone on here say that trans women shouldn't exist, just that their issues are not women's issues cos they are not women. I've seen some deliberate misgendering and dead-naming sure, but that doesn't equate to wanting anyone erased. Baiting? Maybe. Bullying? Possibly. But technically not even a lie. hmm

I don't get why all the issues that trans face (mostly from men) are being laid at womens' door. Have I not turned over enough rocks or something? Probably naive, and genuinely puzzled.

SeekEveryEveryKnownHidingPlace Wed 23-May-18 19:17:43

I always wonder what on earth they think they mean by 'denying us the right to exist'.

You exist. We see you, there you are.

Baroquehavoc Wed 23-May-18 19:17:51

The only reason crisp linked the article is so that they could write terf lots of times.

And since when has Tara wolf been a feminist?

MyAuntyBadger Wed 23-May-18 19:18:33

(Tara Wolf is the TRA found guilty of attacking Maria M at Speakers Corner.)

bd67th Wed 23-May-18 19:19:36

@Nibledbyducks shhh nobody mention Mexico!

What about Mexico?

HotRocker Wed 23-May-18 19:20:29

First paragraph, I think they’ve got it the wrong way around.
All I can say to these so called feminists, is enjoy your erasure.

CertainHalfDesertedStreets Wed 23-May-18 19:21:34

I thought you were too busy icing a cake getting on with real life to continue to debate? But then you've started a new thread. It's almost as though you're...not being completely honest shock

TerfsUp Wed 23-May-18 19:22:30

Freedom News is "[a]n independent, radical co-op controlled by its volunteers, Freedom runs Britain’s oldest anarchist press and its largest bookshop".

crispbuttyfan Wed 23-May-18 19:23:04


I typed nuthin!
it was copy and paste...

spontaneousgiventime Wed 23-May-18 19:23:04

Slice of GF cake anyone?

NotAnotherFeckingMuftiDay Wed 23-May-18 19:23:54


TerfsUp Wed 23-May-18 19:24:14

And Freedom News is not "feminist", no matter how @crispbuttyfan tries to spin it.

TerfsUp Wed 23-May-18 19:25:07

You typed the thread header, @crispbuttyfan, describing Freedom News as "feminist" when it is not. Next time, try being honest.

crispbuttyfan Wed 23-May-18 19:25:27


I simply used the words of the article, that I had no input into, a bit of a stretch to blame me for any spin..

spontaneousgiventime Wed 23-May-18 19:26:44

Wasn't me Officer - honest! hmm

crispbuttyfan Wed 23-May-18 19:28:00

from the article... "As feminists we reject the TERF notion of a woman. "

Oh I'm sorry, are mumsnet users also the judge and jury of who are feminists as well as a woman? I'll try to remember..... no promises though..

Truscum Wed 23-May-18 19:32:24

‘Denying we exist’ is a nonsense phrase really.

Of course they exist. They are right there.

What they mean is that you won’t validate their existence. If you don’t play into the fetish it comes crumbling down and the allure disappears.

And for some reason, they think that using that nonsense phrase will instantly cease all debate, as no normal person would want someone to stop existing. Because that’s death. However most people with a rain cell can see that there is no argument over TRA’s actual existence.

I’m often accused of ‘denying’ their right to exist because I believe that unless you have a diagnosis of gender dysphoria, and only dress up for kicks, then you are not trans anything. You are a cross dresser.

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