Sexism/other issues in the Green party England & Wales - Discussion Thread 3

[fromorbit]

Zack Polanski is making things bigger yet again so another thread needed.

Well things have developed rather a lot since the start. ZP started out as being another sexist guy in politics - no shortage those around, but he thought he could take it to a new level and he proved he could do it.

The Green threads have followed his rise from the start of with the Hypnoboobs scandal and much more. There is also:

Mothin Ali as deputy Leader who clearly doesn't believe in trans thinking, but cleverly sidesteps round talking about it, has always had a issues with encouraging racist violence and is now encouraging people to sue the Green party if they attempt to stop them saying racist stuff.

The other deputy Rachel Millward represents the posh rich faction of the Greens who manages to sounding like Reform when opposing Asylum Seekers in her area, but at the same time saying we are too harsh on immigrants in general. Obviously she also doesn't believe women are a thing. Yet she is the least crazy when violence is concerned compared to ZP, and Mothin.

Hypnoboobs scandal got worse recently when it became clear from BBC footage ZP actively believed in the Hypnoboobs thesis rather than being tricked into it.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn9enygvezeo

Alongside all this there is constant ongoing attacks on biological reality from the party in interviews and in policy.

Now in the last week or so after a longstanding spate of antisemetic rhetoric from some Greens during the election campaign and ZP downplaying it. We have synagogues, schools, ambulances attacked, two Jewish people dead and ZP berating unarmed police for risking their lives in fighting a violent killer who was still armed with a knife things have come to a crisis point.

The Greens are becoming ever more sinister with dozens of candidates sounding like they are seventies NF supporters with comments about uppity women and Jewish power. The huge drama over a crazy motion which they were trying to pass against Israel at conference alongside a motion to prevent women having sports will surface again their September conference.

It seems likely after next week The Greens are going to be running a bunch of councils which doesn't bode well after their antics in Bristol.

Yet there is hope, in Bristol women are fighting back_: www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5455053-bristol-council-is-about-to-be-sued_

The fight back from Green Women's Declaration, ( https://www.greenwomensdeclaration.uk/ ) continues and the court cases against GPEW from Emma Bateman and Shahrar Ali are developing, both getting through legal delaying tactics as they move to trial. Gardening is needed. These cases if successful could be dramatic in their impact.

First thread - where you can follow the rise of ZP and lots of other scandal
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5328986-greens-internal-drama-warms-up

Second Thread:
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5456759-sexismother-issues-in-the-green-party-england-wales-discussion-thread-2?

Note the Scottish Greens which are a separate party to the Green Party England/Wales have their own thread for all their sexist drama. They split off because GPEW didn't hate biology and women/gays enough at the time.
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5313420-scottish-greens-being-sexist-again?page=1

"I'll be there for you with my solidarity and support"

I'm imagining the Friends Theme Tune as they offer thoughts and prayers whilst they stand there watching a Jewish member of the Greens getting the shit kicked out of them by the Greens for Palestine for being a Zionist. They will have been, and I quote the motion's proposer Lubna Spartan, "hunted down in the same way as the Nazis" by force. But apparently she didn't mean it about British Jews or something.

The idea that anyone Jewish will stay in the Green Party with that in mind, and be reassured by these clearly coordinated meaningless posts, is quite the thing.

Yes, I think you could be right about tactical voting. There’s a point when voters stop seeing parties as a harmless alternative that can give the government a ‘bloody nose’ in a by-election, and start seeing them as an active danger.

Andrew Feinstein stood last time against Starmer as an independent focussing mostly on Gaza. He came second but his votes combined with the Greens wouldn’t have won it.

Following Labour here is the official reaction from Lib Dems and Tories.

The Greens are going to be branded as a racist party by the others. I Imagine Plaid will do the same. This is interesting ground it bears parallels to what happened to Corbyn's Labour, but last time the Greens were also condemning Corbyn.

Lib Dems: "The motion passed today at Green Party Conference actively undermines a two-state solution, and does not address the rising threats of Islamophobia and Antisemitism here in the UK.

"This is a divisive motion that pours fuel on the fire of tensions in the UK, and will leave many British Jews feeling less safe. It is irresponsible and deeply insensitive for the Greens to play politics with an issue as sensitive as this one.

"This policy conflates British Jews attending synagogues with the most extreme positions of the Israeli far right, and will cause concern throughout the Jewish community here in Britain. I want all our Jewish friends and neighbours to know that the Liberal Democrats hear your concerns and condemn this Green Party policy.

"It should go without saying that to conflate all Jews with the extremists in the Israeli cabinet, in the same way as comparing all Muslims with the extremists in Hamas, is utterly wrong.

"To those that joined the Green Party thinking it was a political movement that cared about the environment and tackling the climate crisis - you are welcome in the Liberal Democrats"

Tories: "British Jews should not have to disclaim a belief in Jewish self-determination and the existence of Israel in order to be accepted by a British political party.

"One look beneath the surface of Zack Polanski’s Green Party shows a party toxic to its core. It is clear the Green Party cannot bring itself to stand unambiguously against those who hate Jews.

"Antisemitism has no place in our society. The Conservatives will always stand with British Jews"

I think the response of the Scottish Greens and the SNP will also be interesting.

I dont feel the normal Greens are equal to the factions shaking the party apart tbh.

My money is on a Yourparty style collapse.

It may be possible to rescue the original environmental party from the ruins.

We elected 2 green councillors recently. I am composing an email to both asking them to stand down and allow a new election because they misled the voters. There were no expressions of antisemitism in their campaigning.
I know lots of traditional greens are very worried about how they will be seen and I hope my action will go some way to making them think very hard about the actions they have allowed to take place.
If the greens knew this motion was going to be at conference, then the right minded had a duty to show up and vote against.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/oct/02/green-party-anti-zionism-motion-attempt-tell-jews-how-to-think?

The racist minister Itamar Ben-Gvir is a Zionist, but so are many of the Jewish and Israeli anti-occupation activists who volunteer to act as a “protective presence”, putting their own bodies between settler extremists and Palestinian villagers in the West Bank. To brand everyone under that one umbrella as a racist shows a deep ignorance of what the word Zionism means and the sheer range of people who identify with it.

I would only argue that, as this has been explained over and over again (one assumes including by those Greens who attempted to amend or stop the motion from passing), at this point it’s not ignorance.

As with the attempts to define opposing gender critical feminism as left wing, there has been a move to characterise anti-Zionism and anti-Israeli feeling as the default left-wing position. It’s always worth looking at the organisations on the left who push back against this.

“Zionism encompasses a wide range of political beliefs. Many people who identify as Zionists support Palestinian self-determination, equal rights and an end to occupation…A blanket equation of Zionism with racism disregards those differences and risks treating people who oppose oppression as supporters of it.”

https://www.saasuk.org/articles/socialists-against-antisemitism-condemns-the-green-party-s-zionism-is-racism-resolution

What has happened to Your Party? I was wondering about them, now that conference season has come around. Didn't they have a conference last year and Zarah Sultana spent the whole time outside protesting?

Zarah Sultana AT zarahsultana
Reminder: anti-Zionism is not antisemitism.
The smears won’t work.

Apparently Lubna Speitan left them to join the Greens because she didn't think that they were radical enough on Gaza.

I can't find any mention of a main party conference.

Your Party Cymru held an inaugural conference in Aberystwyth in July this year.

The Morning Star had a number of reports on it.
https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/political-statement-adopted-your-party-cymru-members

I can't find any other reports, not even on Nation Cymru, although that site did say beforehand that Corbyn would be speaking.

Owen Jones trying to ride two horses on twitter

There is nothing racist about any ethnic or religious group wanting their own homeland. The problem is if this desire is at the expense of another people. Zionism in practise meant "a homeland at the expense of Palestinians". It's really not hard to grasp this basic point!

But when asked what the motion means 'in practice'.

On what grounds would you disagree with my statement? Did Zionism establish a state at the expense of another people? Yes or no? Personally I’d favour a single state with equal rights for all but that’s not for me to decide, which is why I wouldn’t have voted for the Green motion

So he concedes that the logical conclusion of the motion is that Israel should cease to be.

All grist to the mill for anyone hoping to stoke up fear amongst moderate Israelis.

I think you can argue that it is not anti-Catholic to argue about the ins and outs of Catholic doctrine.

It is anti-Catholic to call anyone who believes in that doctrine a devil worshipper.

Or to suggest Vatican City has no right to exist.

I do t know if this has been highlighted but this was one of the proposed amendments.

Although thinking about it that amnesty document did describe a random selection of Christians as 'anti-rights' because of their assumed views on abortion, even though people who describe themselves as Christians have a range of views.

Adam Langleben predicts the following

What happens next: The moderate Greens (MPs and a minority of historic activists) have woken up to the monster they have created. They will bring forward constitutional amendments to try to control conference in future and change how decisions are made and applied. BUT...
The people they are dealing with are not idiots. They are ruthless and effiective organisers. They will see this coming and will mobilise (as they very effectively did yesterday) to stop it. Moderate Greens don't have the numbers or organisation to stop them.
The David Miller tendency (Neo-Nazi antisemitism in anti-racist clothes) is now the dominant political tendency inside of the Green Party. The young hipster Corbynites can't see it yet, but when they do they will leave. Leaving a husk of a major political party controled by loons
Moderate Greens, (in political terms, the left flank of Labour's soft left with some Green shoots) are the most ill equipped group of people to fight a fight like this. Like bringing a feather to a gun fight.

I think he's saying here that Be Kinders are finding out some people are actually right fuckers who ruin everything even for good people and you have to always be on your guard for them...

Do the David Miller tendency think Trans women are women?

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https://x.com/b_judah/status/2106829242730533078

What makes this Green motion so ignorant is that only 7% of West Bank Palestinians and 5% in Gaza back the Green Party’s rejection of a Two State Solution in favour of One State. Majorities, in fact growing majorities, back Two States.

Back in 2003 I took part in the Don't Attack Iraq protests.

Even then what eventually put me off was the hijacking by the Gaza protestors.

I have some sympathy for young naive Greens for this reason because I think many will rapid feel the disillusionment and betrayal I did.

Fwiw my main reason for protesting was because there was a lack of plan and exit strategy for the UK if we did attack and that it would only result in greater harm rather than being sympathetic to Saddam Hussain or ignorant about what he was doing to citizens or a potential threat.

This lack of planning and exit strategy issue has been a very big feature of western political mistakes over the last 20 years.

It's kinda depressing in its own right to keep seeing the same patterns.

The vast majority of Palestinians when asked declare they want a one state solution. They do not favour two states at all. And should there be just one state you can guarantee that there would not be the broadly tolerant or democratic society that people envisage - because Hamas is a religious fundamentalist party with roots in the Muslim Brotherhood. What they want is a caliphate - with muslim dominance and death to the jews.

Hamas deplores the Palestinian Authority that runs the West Bank - and sees them as corrupted sell outs.

There is a really interesting series on you tube called 'the Ask Project' in which a questions are posed to wide sections of Palestinians and Israelis. and the overwhelming majority of Palestinians say they do not favour two states. That the whole of the land is theirs: 'from the river to the sea'. Young people are pretty much indoctrinated into this position and it rolls off the tongue as if very well rehearsed.

Lubna Speitan is British Palestinian who said Hamas should not be treated as a terrorist group and claimed it was only banned in Britain to undermine 'armed resistance' to Israel.

So although I thought that comment by the Lib Dem’s was clever to conflate all Jews with the extremists in the Israeli cabinet, in the same way as comparing all Muslims with the extremists in Hamas, is utterly wrong. I don’t think the Greens will see a comparison to Hamas as problematic.

@ArabellaScott My money is on a Yourparty style collapse. I really hope so. This has become one toxic party.

Leaving a husk of a major political party controled by loons

Actually I think it’s a husk of a major political party controlled by extremists, not loons.