NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #50

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence was 29 July 2025. It will resume again over 1 to 2 September for closing submissions.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February 2025. Sandie Peggie returned to give more evidence on 29 July 2025.

Access to view the second part of the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 42: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379820-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-42 25 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 43: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379979-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-43 25 July 2025 to 27 July 2025
Thread 44: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5380196-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-44 25 July 2025 to 28 July 2025
Thread 45: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5381518-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-45 28 July 2025 to 28 July 2025
Thread 46: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5381640-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-46 28 July 2025 to 29 July 2025
Thread 47: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5382102-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-47 29 July 2025 to 29 July 2025
Thread 48: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5382317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-48 29 July 2025 to 31 July 2025
Thread 49: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5383443-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-49 31 July 2025 to 8 August 2025

NC Peculiar thing c [about] R evident in highly incomplete evidence is way patient safety allegations swung in and out of view in proceedings

I got bumped out at about 1pm, too. I nudged my computer mouse in some significant way.

I would have loved to hear NC comment on Isla Bumba.

Still WFTCHTJ. Would someone in Room 4 kindly let us know how many people are waiting? I appreciate that the clerk is multitasking and can't admit people instantly. Possibly people at work stopped for their lunch at 1pm and tried to join, too.

A combination of having various windows open, using predictive text, understanding that ChatGPT needs to start on the image and then I can return to it, and being a former IT consultant and knowing how text selection and deletion works - I sometimes have to remove links to TT’s images and views etc.

Oh, and I’m a brilliant speed reader.

Break

I've very glad that NC identifies one of the Remaining Mysteries as the Missing Witnesses. Jamie Doyle et al.

from herald
1:19pm
Ms Cunningham also questions the credibility of other witnesses.
Kate Searle, Dr Upton's line manager, did not submit correspondence that clearly fell within the demands for disclosure by the tribunal, including what Ms Cunningham calls the "foot in mouth" email sent to consultant colleagues in which she said: "We all support her [Dr Upton] and condemn the actions of Sandie".
"That that came to light so late in the day is in my submission strikingly to the discredit of all of those witnesses in whose possession it was."
Ms Cunningham also criticised NHS Fife's equality lead, Isla Bumba.
She was asked about biological sex regarding female-only spaces, and said: “I hazard a guess that I would be female but nobody knows what their chromosomes are.”
Ms Cunningham said: "Her claim to be unable to speak to her own sex with certainty was one of the most extraordinary moments of what has been on any view an extraordinary hearing."

5 waiting to get in.

Ring them

01382 221 578

This clerk is not very good.

Edit I wasn't trying to sound Scottish

Another gem:
NC Patient safety allegations- you should draw inferences and pass burden to R to give explanation.

Followed by mic drop😀

From TT

NC Can leave you to read re E Davidson's credibility. NC Takes me to the remaining mysteries. Peculiar thing c R evident in highly incomplete evidence is way patient safety allegations swung in and out of view in proceedings. No good explanation from R of what was going on here

NC Unsolved mystery of what happened when board got to see DU allegations in detail. First sent to board on 11/6/24 - great deal of material in allegations seems to have been known to a number of people since Dec 2023. Profound peculiarity of R evidence. Suggest you draw inferences.

DU had seen poss professional danger to him of making allegations so late both he and board hesitated before relying on them in formal proceedings cos of danger of DU. Board had had C suspended for months since CR incident so they needed good explanation

NC Patient safety allegations- you should draw inferences and pass burden to R to give explanation. Surprising absence of Jamie Doyle, Angela Sheppard, [and other names] and the gaps in the documentary record. Makes it impossible for R to discharge burden against them.

NC Further mystery.

[short adjournment]

Thank you, @ickky

JKR needs to get on the case stat.

That that came to light so late in the day is in my submission strikingly to the discredit of all of those witnesses in whose possession it was.

This speaks volumes - they were all curating their responses to the request for e-mails. They all decided not to include this one. They all lied

no They aren’t: lots of babies are made without fathers and some without mothers.

Could a fellow observer please let me know the email address given in the side bar to contact the court with any queries. Thanks!

I don't think IB was taking the tribunal for fools. I think she has been practicing hard, and is probably up to White Queen standard: she can believe six impossible things before breakfast.

But they need two gametes. Small ones: male-produced sperm which trans identified men also have, and Large ones: female-produced eggs which trans identified men don’t have. In law, the producer of the sperm is the father. The producer of the egg is the mother.

Er a sperm and an egg is involved, and one comes from each sex. So regardless of a later family set up there is a father and mother. I guess you failed GCSE biology.

Are they the ones delivered by a stork?

There isn't one on my screen but here is their email

[email protected]

NC said one of these Mysterious Missing Witnesses was someone called 'Shwaites' (or that's what it sounded like) who was the colleague in the changing room. I don't remember hearing this name before. Anyone else?

I have just rung the number ickky gave above. The person who answered said she'd pass on the message to the relevant clerk, and I'm now back in.

Edit - and all the chat messages have gone.

Are they the ones delivered by a stork?

Or they are clones.

As so many of JR's witnesses appeared to be - all spouting the same sentences.

While there's a break
-BouncyCastleNHSSquirrels - I thought of you recently when I chanced upon an episode of Green Wing on telly - I've looked online but the specific sketch isn't available on youTube unfortunately.

The seriously weird admin worker was being unsuccessfully interviewed for a promotion... while presenting as a squirrel in a business suit.
She appeared to be trying to trap the interviewer into blurting out WE WON'T PROMOTE YOU BECAUSE YOU'RE A SQUIRREL! which of course he was carefully avoiding.

When it was made years ago, the idea of a squirrel being promoted to a position of responsibility in a hospital was surreal comedy.

The we found out about NHS Fife..😧

there is a way!

Brain damaged comment