NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #42

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025

JR Top email [JR had lost page] Yr email to KSon 30.12. What did you mean by "I guess its a good thing"?
MC I felt it fortunate none of us had the process at our fing ertips and we didnt have to do on a regular basis
JR [new doc] Email 5.1 to KS, LC, ED, LH and ? "as discussed need to know is small" Why send this?

Many tech companies have the same verbal policy now. Crucially, they understand that electronic communications are forever and leave an unalterable trace, so don't write it down.

If your job is to sift CVs, nobody asks you to account for why these 400 go on the No pile and these 50 go on the Maybe pile. Has always happened, with females of reproductive age for example, as well as people hitting their mid fifties. All these people have done is added 'young trans identifying males' to the mental discrimination list. If someone ever bought it up or could ever prove that their CV immediately went on the NO pile, all the recruiter has to say is well you got a 7 in GCSE drama and all the rest had 8s and 9s and that was the only way to distinguish you, or whatever.

Which just makes me more and more astounded, knowing how competitive medicine is, that a junior doctor, still only on placement, prioritised transitioning, never mind starting a witch hunt for unsupportive colleagues in the new workplace, at this stage of their career. Incredible. Reminds me of good old Dr Harrop, and he was more established.

Bugger, wrong Bluestocking patron

Was meant for Myrtle

'DU has a PC'. We all have 6 of the 9 PCs. One particular PC seems to be given far more weight than any of the other ones.

I think DUs actions if proven to be dishonest go further than a matter of probity from the point of view of the GMC. If his motive was to malign a professional colleague in a clinical setting, that is of a different order from bumping up your mileage on an expenses claim.

MC Cos we're the leadership team, which is small
JR Why did they need to know the C had been Sx?
MC Cos a potential concern DU might be on shift w Miss Peggie which wld be difficult. We wanted to avoid. Med rotas are written well in advance. Jr fellows self rosta and meet

I couldn't copy this but the below report has an explanation of a wide range of views that are "gender critical" and so legally protected, noting that many (myself included) would not call ourselves "gender critical". It includes i.e. opinions like transwomen shouldn't be in women's only crisis centres. I was relieved, honestly.

www.sullivanreview.uk/barriers.pdf

Yes. I would hope they’d be concluding that they needed to correct their training and facilities so that the rights and needs of trans people would be correctly maintained without impacting anyone else’s rights.
no discrimination, no privilege.

So MC unlike KS was able to clock that Upton was a bloke.

DU will have to produce the phone at that point!

She’s finally got a witness that she feels is reliable and supports her defence.

Very much appreciated

Thank you.

The chair is also appreciated because according to Dr Dame Katy Denise, transwomen often have to sit on the floor or the stairs, so I know I am privileged.

JR is labouring the rostering. MC's answers are very slooow and veeerrry detailed.

What is the point of these questions about the bloody rota? She’s deliberately wasting time 😡

....and to remind everyone again...despite what stonewall says gender is not a protected characteristic unless they have a GRC. How does this get let slip all the time?

This clears things up a bit, I've had trouble following it.

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/25341258.upton-altered-records-include-peggie-patient-concern/

JR really dragging this out. Feels like she’s running the clock down so that NC doesn’t get a fair amount of time for the cross examination.

CriticalCondition · Today 14:51
JR already running over her 30 mins

and I haven't been c&pasting as she's waffling on with MC about how jr docs arrange their shifts... eg crucial stuff like
MC We have 6 jr shifts across the 24 hr period, minimum dr staffing levels to provide cover. There are limitation on when return from a shift - min hrs of 12.5. Breaks after night shifts.

Don't worry. The panel are thinking exactly the same thing.

Ffs JR wrap it up!!

Hahahahahaha JR complains about apinging noise coming from the gallery and asks them to turn it off.

Turns out it was coming from the witness.

No, the GR characteristic is for anyone who is going through the 'reassignment' process or who thinks that they might. Terribly vague and wide.

Very difficult to change doctors’ shifts cus they are special. Nurses are interchangeable and ten-a-penny

5 mins of stuff about jr doc's shifts.
I recognise that there's some relevance to keeping DU & SP apart, but ..