NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #42

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025

From the transcript on the Herald live feed.
“someone in the loo, inevitably it’s Sandie”.

Any ideas how he knew it was Sandie in the loo?

Had she been chatting to others in the room I’m sure that’s a detail he’d have noted wouldn’t he? (That assumes the loo isn’t in a floor to ceiling space. Ours aren’t. So when I hear people enter I sometimes stay out and listen to conversation 😉)

I have a mentaI image of the judge throwing open his front door at the end of yet another day in court listening to this absolute mince from the respondents, shouting FFS as he kicks off his shoes and drops his trousers in the hallway, then throwing himself down on the sofa to crack open a can of Peroni and catch up on MAFSA. The man must be pondering his life choices at this point

Yes, imagine having to keep a straight face through all this. Whilst calculating how much Counsel is being paid & how that compares with your own earnings

I'm just OMG 'ing repeatedly now!

Connection issues you say? During the IT call? Hmmmmm

A reminder that CE is following a very clear pathway in her qq, taken from JB's report:
first pg or your report, you commented on 3 things n report, contemporaneousness of phone note,
sync issue and
requirement/limit of forensic evidence.

Given these are screenshots, essentially photos, you can make them look any way you want.
IMNATP.

Although I suppose if DU is found to have manipulated his phone evidence and is exposed not just as a liar but someone who's tried to impede justice by faking record, he'll have torpedoed his defence himself and JR can focus on saving as much face and money as possible for NHSF.

She could only do that if she dumped Upton as a client. Otherwise she would still have to excuse Upton somehow - and do so without trying to shift blame onto NHSFife.

From TT

JB - best way to present any exam of phone, computer etc to sit in person, or this way you record to show what was done in teams meeting. would allow me to confirm what happened
CE - why do that?
JB - I should be able to reproduce, re-examine to confirm findings, without recording I've no way
CE 1720 - PD's commentary on your report, inc having failed to record

Fifer : ah kin tell Speccie Loddie is gonnae gie Forensic Backgroon a sick IT burn here. Gonnae need thae fancy Halon Fire Extinguishers pronto.

Blimey. That sizzling noise is a goose being well and truly cooked.

stay put that should read. Not out

Oh yes !!!! JB is delivering facts

Oh ffs JR

Have a go at him for misgendering someone?

From TT

CE - what PD does is put a scsh from teams chat, in that chat, message from mr watson, think you've frozen beth, frozen again, what effect of that on collecting that info
JB - connection has gone down, for however long that went on you couldn't observe what was going on

😱😱😱

JR has found a "misgendering" of Upton in a report produced by JB. Is that the level she's going to play this game?

There was no real forensic analysis of Upton's phone. He downloaded the data himself while remotely directed by the NHS Fife IT guy. The independent IT guy is interpreting this evidence provided by Upton.

JR why did you call him a man

Well he's clearly sane. And of a certain age. And not a complete loon who thinks men can be women.

THIS IS WHY THEY ONLY GAVE SCREENSHOTS!!!

This is evidence of corruption, the NHSF guys were likely compelled to provide doctored evidence! Shocking!

I think it just said nurse before rather than naming a particular nurse, he then later edited it to add sandies name

All I can say is ‘sad times’.

Part of my job is assessing evidence & getting expert opinion on documents - especially the ones used to support fraud - you can never underestimate the over confidence of those who produce ‘doctored’ documents digitally, mostly because they’re ’not techy’. Most people reviewing them aren’t either, but those aren’t the people you need to worry about. Experts draw out the hardest to see details & those aren’t what give the game away. You usually start out from the suspicion of something ‘not quite right’ and let the expert review to see if there is anything they can add to your suspicion. You can’t ‘lead’ them to what triggered your attention, they have to independently review & give you a report based on their opinion. You hit the jackpot if they pick out both your hunch & explain it’s not genuine, and add more evidence to support your suspicions.

JR’s job here is to cast doubt on this independent expert’s opinion. Without her own expert giving any evidence or explanation for the discrepancies, she’s got a mountain to climb IMO.

From TT

CE 1720 - PD's commentary on your report, inc having failed to record what PD does is put a scsh from teams chat, in that chat, message from mr watson, think you've frozen beth, frozen again, what effect of that on collecting that info

JB - connection has gone down, for however long that went on you couldn't observe what was going on

JR - didn't look at DU phone directly
JB - no
JR - you saw PD sc sh
CE - object DU produced them
JR - mixed, some from both, instructed by C solicitor
JB - correct
JR - not join instruction
JB - no.
JR - 1643, your report, you say told DU produced notes on his phone, were you

Fifer : if ye hink JR is gonnae trouble Speccie Loddie, yev got anither hink comin.

JR is having a go at JB over pronouns.
Desperate.

MORE FECKING WITTERING ABOUT PRONOUNS.

Cross exam. JR's tone is clipped, challenging witnesses single (typo) use of male pronoun in account that generally uses she/her.

Seems unkind and weird. Sad times. 😟

Brilliant comeback as IT guy points out he used 'she' elsewhere so the 'he' was a typo.