NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #42

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025

Kindness to - and honesty with - people we like and who agree with us is cheap and no test of character. Real kindness is shown to people we dislike, to people who aren't kind in return. Real honesty is shown to people with whom we don't agree and to whom lying would suit our purposes very much better.

Other people can work out if KS and DU are really kind or not.

What will we all do next week when this is all over?

He’s played them all like a fiddle. Sad times.

If DrU has said 'I recorded my recollections of the distressing incident, and how it made me feel' that would have been OK.
But oh no, it had to be literally contemporaneous🙄Silly boy.

Yes, he needs his wife to do that kind of thing for him, he said. Massive dose of ‘I’m too girly for that, so DW does it.’.

contemporaneousness = contemporaneity

BOOM! This was superimposed on top of the screenshot..

All the things I was supposed to be doing the last 2 weeks 😀

And in the NHS we are always taught to include “written in retrospect”

I’s something even app and tracker users do when they want to manipulate continuous days of exercising (say) to gather a badge or meet challenge criteria. It’s the commonest advice to people who have internet outages due to tornadoes or snow.

JB 21aug edit date, slightly diff colour, [raspberry, perhaps?] and creation on 26oct. Only way to make it look that way is the version hist is superimposed

Superimposed how?

JR quiet, busy looking at papers and taking long drink of water. Must be 'saving up her questions' again.😂

Mr B is very clear and cogent in his replies. Looking around court as if confidently giving lecture or presentation.

JR has hands in lap while everyone else taking lots of notes.

Long pause after Mr B finishes a long explanation with everyone quite still as if everyone is still thinking it through.

Sad times ☹️

I think he saying the opposite. That that is the only way that could happen i.e the BS google sync issue as suggested was to try and cover up the clear trail in the metadata that the notes were edited later and added ro and hence are not contemparaneous.

JB - google syncs every second, syncing all of your devises, would have to be something catastrophic on google servers, can't replicate.

I'm learning so much today!

JB knows his shit. What can JR possibly chuck at him?

Oh dear oh dear oh dear. Very sad times now indeed. A recording would have cleared everything up but alas Fife didn't make one. Quelle surprise.

From TT

JB - moment of connection, creation time exists, no earlier edit time when I actually wrote it.
CE - you said not possible to have earlier edit dates, look at sc sh both you and PD agree no valid tech explanation for phenomenon
JB - not possible, tried changing phone times and dates it's not possible.

Fifer : whit Speccielock Halmes is saying, is when you've eliminated the impossible, what remains must be the fuckin truth ken.

CE - can you explain how these screenshots are poss
JB - scsh 20 for eg, reports a version hist of...
J - hang on
JB - scsh20 porports note edited on
CE - can I break it down, note below it?
JB - starts alpha med, the one where version hist show 21aug edit date, slightly diff colour, and creation on 26oct. Only way to make it look that way is the version hist is superimposed. Not a note ass with google keep
CE - anything else on 20 that looks like superimposition
JB - yes version hist, and not possible to have date with that edit time.

Fifer : OH NUT. DEH TELL AYS THIT IT IS EFTIR AW POSSIBLE TAE EDIT A DIGITAL PICTUR FILE! JIST IMAGINE THE TECHNOLOGY NEEDIT TAE DAE SIK A HING?

CE - onto 3rd category, requirement for forensic review of device. 1695 - starts, at time of writing, see that? talk about recording of meeting, why helpful?
JB - best way to present any exam of phone, computer etc to sit in person, or this way you record to show

Fifer : Aye so here he's gonnae run us doon the big List Of Weys A Loddie Wi An Actual Forensic Backgroon Wid Dae A Guid Job.

I like the way he looks at the person asking the question when it's being asked, but then looks at the Judge when answering.

This is what J kept telling witnesses to do in February (when they were sitting on the other side of the room facing the camera) and, imho, shows that he's an experienced (expert) witness

Unless JR has done a matrix-style tech download in the break between witnesses, she’s not going to be able to shake this in cross.

Do you think that this may be the way it is heading? Introducing this evidence about date stamps seems a little odd if they are trying to support DU’s evidence. The IT guy cannot explain it, and cannot confirm that DU didn’t mess with dates/times.
Will be interested in the forensic guys take on the situation.

JFC they actually attempted to (badly) fuck with evidence that was going to be presented at a tribunal?

Surely there has to be some sort of penalty for this?

Im gonna guess not very much.. she might try the kitchen sink at this point 😆

JB is money very well spent by Sandie's team.