Trans Ideology - a real life debate

[Forester1]

So something that is far too rare - a proper debate

For me positions can be summarised as:

Mark Glenening - free speech paramount - and shouldnt have compelled speech
Helen Joyce - Single sex spaces are needed - males need to keep out - however they identify
Freda Wallace - Me, me, me, my sex life, me
Peter Tatchell - Akin to fight for gay rights, black rights. I don’t see any issues. Be kind.

No, Rainbows, Malaga Airport is fine, just not the acronym!

OK, I thought someone had been deleted for using the words Malaga Airport as a code word for the acronym that dare not mention its name.

My post from 11:32 has survived so far.

Can someone who’s on Twitter tell those of us who aren’t what was the response to Freda’s “dismantling Helen Joyce” tweet, please?

Because to me all the dismantling seemed to go the other way.

It’s a relief to have a debate where D Hayton isn’t being wheeled out to represent women.

I enjoyed watching the debate but was very disappointed at Freda's contribution. While it was always going to be difficult to debate with someone of Helen Joyce's ability, it would have been helpful if Freda had been more respectful. It didn't make the trans community look great.

Yes - this is the paper

Bet he's regretting that date!

Freda was all potty mouth and no trousers, no coherent argument and zero dignity. Talking about effing in such crude terms, while getting increasingly drunk, Freda actually reminded me of the Macc Lads. The sunlight streamed in!

There are far more eloquent transwomen out there who could have helped to strengthen Peter’s feeble arguments. But no, Pete dropped the ball, choosing an absolute car crash as his wingman!

Maybe Tatchell is a GC double agent? We all judged Professor Snape and he turned out to be a hero.

Freda:

'... my aspiration is to be a problem to a sane world, because there is no fucking sane world. If you want to be - if you want to aspire to a sane world that dis - you know that is a really bad, that's a dark road to go down.'

1:01

Some responses and some of Freda responses to people.

Quite honestly, Freda needs a friend to step in and tell Freda to step away from social media for a bit.

Thanks boiled!

It looks like that but I actually think it's thigh fat spilling over the top of stockings. Still 🤮 though.

Agreed. That's exactly why I think it's important for any discussion, about where rights and laws need to be considered, to represent the viewpoint of someone with gender dysphoria. I've not heard Freda agree or deny that Freda has gender dysphoria but I would suggest that if Freda does, it's really not obvious.

Debbie Hayton is mentioned above. As eloquent and clear as Debbie Hayton has been helping to articulate some clear messaging about the impacts of pushing a compelled belief in gender identity, there are many women who find it difficult to accept Debbie using women's toilets. Me included. Also listening to an interview that Debbie and her wife gave together, it's really not clear that Debbie would value the needs of women in such a debate. Possibly, but not clear.

Instead, I would far rather see a transwoman who has already said on another thread that transwomen can/could/should organise to put forward a suggestion for third spaces. Especially so when this came from an agreement that any transwomen who just want to push Malaga Airport need just have to accept that this isn't a good enough reason to reject third spaces.

Is it just me who read this in the voice of Rick from Rick and Morty?

He’s certainly scored a spectacular own goal, if this was unintentional.

Do you have the link to the tweet by any chance please @Boiledbeetle ?
I'd like to have a nosy and see what's being said.

That main comment from Freda is a very interesting positioning of why Freda objects to the criticism Freda has had. The way that it's written reminds me of some of the things I saw when I took a look at some literature that Reduxx published from the middle of the south coast of Spain.

Agreed. That's exactly why I think it's important for any discussion, about where rights and laws need to be considered, to represent the viewpoint of someone with gender dysphoria. I've not heard Freda agree or deny that Freda has gender dysphoria but I would suggest that if Freda does, it's really not obvious.

Freda exists, lots of ‘Fredas’ exist. Worse ‘Fredas’ exist. When debating laws and rights it is important that ‘Freda’ is represented so we can be clear who it is women’s rights are being dismantled in favour of rather than pretend it is for children or nice sounding men.

They could suggest he steps away from the fishnet tights while they're at it.

Having Freda there was like debating with a pot plant - albeit a very mouthy sweary pot plant.
👨🏽👱‍♀️👨🏽🪴👨🏻‍🦲

No, no, no, no, no more drinking 😂😂😂

https://twitter.com/Freda_Wa11ace/status/1717519634134389166?s=19

That's the dismantling Helen Joyce one.

And alcohol.