Trans Ideology - a real life debate

[Forester1]

So something that is far too rare - a proper debate

For me positions can be summarised as:

Mark Glenening - free speech paramount - and shouldnt have compelled speech
Helen Joyce - Single sex spaces are needed - males need to keep out - however they identify
Freda Wallace - Me, me, me, my sex life, me
Peter Tatchell - Akin to fight for gay rights, black rights. I don’t see any issues. Be kind.

This is the description -

Debates surrounding gender identity have gained prominence in the last few years.

Trans rights activists have argued that trans people have a right to be recognised as their preferred gender in both the private and public spheres and that the law should protect this right.

Gender critical groups, however, claim that efforts to undermine single sex spaces put women’s safety at risk while attempts to police language on this issue constitute a threat freedom of speech.

This panel event disentangled this debate by giving speakers from both sides the opportunity to present their case for whether transgender ideology is necessary outgrowth of liberal values, or a threat to them.

Oh goody, I've been waiting for this. That's my evening sorted.

Thank you, I put it in my watchlist for later.

This is comedy gold.

Squishy bollocks ahoy, but my favourite part is when Tatchell tells the incoherent rambling Wallace, 'no more wine'.

From the debate

Just started watching. Freda does not seem to have prepared her starting speech, and I don't understand their argument at all?

Looking forward to watching this one after seeing the stills and quotes on Twitter. Finally, a public debate!

I was surprised by that - seems like a pretty basic thing to do as part of a structured debate

I'm watching it now, but @SaffronSpice (thanks for the nightmare fuel) he's putting me right off my Christmas pudding crisps!

'they don't believe that I can be a lesbian, but any woman that is intimate with me, it's up to her how she describes herself - so when I fuck men with my female penis in fetish clubs that is my choice, it doesn't matter what you think'

Crikey, Fred.

I was planning on an early night in bed with Helen! Shame Freda is going to be there as well!

Threes a crowd and all that!

(And yes this is just so I can find the link again in half an hour)

Here is Freda getting loud and talking over Helen and Peter getting very stern.

45 minutes in if the link doesn't take you there.

Absolute comedy gold!

Let them speak, and let the wine flow!

You beat me too it Arthurbella I was just about to highlight that segment

I thought the trans crowd had told Tatchell not to talk for them?

Fred talks of being treated like a woman in the chippy. Well, if you go in with a skirt round your crotch and fishnet tights, they will. They will be too scared you'll kick off if they don't.

Hang on, is the picture on the YouTube link the same erm lady that's in the fishnet stockings in the photo?
Wow, Photoshop is doing some heavy lifting there mind

Lol at Peter trying to keep Fred in order and preventing him from drinking more wine 😂

I've just finished watching, and I'd definitely recommend it. This issue really needs more debates like this, to bring "both sides" arguments out into the sunlight, to be properly inspected.

They have tried to stop Peter. Only they are very short of ANYONE to defend them on the record in the UK. Plenty of people will take trans money virtually no-one will step up to say anything in their defence because they don't actually have real arguments and also I suspect a lot of them are just following the crowd rather than deeply being invested. Hence it is the same faces on the media Peter, Robin, Willoughby, Wallace all making tired arguments and often making our side look good.

To be fair Peter is way more effective than Willoughby or Wallace. If he leaves the fight the bench is very thin.

This if course is another reason why the parallels Peter loves to draw with Gay rights in the 70s/80s are so thin. No-one backed gay rights then for the cash. That is why Gender Crits have a really strong field of amazing people ready to go on the media, because like those who fought for gay/women's rights before, the people are doing it because they passionately believe in the cause and they are brilliant at arguing it out if they get the chance.

Freda doing sterling work there for the “but hoooooow can you teellll?” brigade 🤪

Arthur?! Arthur????What the hell have I missed?

Not quite sure why the video is cur short? I was really interested to hear why Tatchell was comparing trans issues with race issues, but actually he wasn't...