sarah ditum on Posie parker

[narcymum]

Just saw a tweet where she calls PP a 'poundshop marine le Pen'
WTF! why are women who are supposedly in this fight together actively trying to sabotage another woman's activism?
Can we not move away from this schoolyard shit?

Sorry, Milo 😬

I'm still waiting for an apology for the outright lies and gaslighting Antelope has been doing on this thread.

Today in Labour IDPOL madness:

news.sky.com/story/amp/labour-mp-rupa-huq-accused-of-making-racist-comments-about-chancellor-kwasi-kwarteng-12706333

Antelope could go some way to challenging their troll-like appearance by apologising for their lies and gaslighting on this thread. But this is far from the first time of asking them for that.

Julie and Milo did a debate style tour together in 2015/2016 - dates both in the UK and US

(when they didn’t get cancelled!)

Here’s a US date:

m.youtube.com/watch?v=hMdYV4GUOfM

mancunion.com/2015/10/06/transphobe-julie-bindel-banned-from-free-speech-debate/

Thanks @TheClogLady
and also wow to that article

Not caring doesn't mean that I won't vote for the Left — and yes, I want to see the redistribution of wealth and some reprivatisation. But Labour can't count on me any more.

"Superficially black"!

We are all red inside. lol.

It's an interesting article though. She's clearly struggling with the fact that this is a guy whose accent is, at least in her view, indistinguishable from any other guy from Eton. And the kind of privilege she feels that represents, or the politics she thinks it engenders.

What I always find interesting about this sort of thing is, why doesn't it make the identarians thinks "wait, maybe it's more about class"? It's not like the UK doesn't have a long history of recognizing the elite of any culture whatever their superficial colour.

And it's not that I think class is some kind of gotcha in politics either, but I do wonder when people don't seem to see what is in front of their noses.

Mad innit?

7 years ago Bindel was considered to be considerably MORE toxic than alt-right poster boy Milo and wasn’t even allowed to attend a debate about free speech and feminism at a free speech society!

yet somehow she still wants to see Posie getting a good cancelling?

The purity spiral phenomenon baffles me. Why would you inflict on someone when you’ve previously been harmed by it?

"wait, maybe it's more about class"?

😃

Well, quite.
If you have plenty of cash and went to one of a handful of elite schools, then the Tories don’t care what colour you are - which is why we’ve got an ethnically diverse cabinet run by a woman…

but Labour can’t use class as stick to beat the Tories with because great swathes of Labour MPs also have monied backgrounds and went to the same schools and universities.

it’s a big conundrum and results in supposedly clever people calling each other nasty names like ‘coconut’.

it’s all very off putting for us normies who are worried about gas bills.

I don't like to be too cynical, because all the women stomping on KJK have done stuff to further the cause, but really it's a bit suspicious in terms of their motives, isn't it? KJK has massive, resounding success in Brighton. Feminists panic and try to put her back in her box. Because they now have careers and livelihoods invested in opposing gender ideology and KJK is actually aiming to it. If KJK wins, i.e. if women win this fight, all these top class feminists will be out of a job again.

And after that lovely email she sent them, too.

@turbonerd: and really! Did JB ally with Yanni Yabbadabbadoubolous?

Its not called allying , if its a proper feminist getting paid for it. keep up turbonerd

That is cynical!

But it mirrors pretty much what Adolph Reed (a marxist) and John McWhorter (a liberal) and Glen Loury (a conservative) all say about anti-racist politics in the US - that it is a career stream for some middle class black university grads who a) have no real interest in solving race issues and b) whose economic interests are themselves aligned with the middle classes.

It's quite interesting to see the patterns.

Just listening to KJK's "terftalk" from yesterday and she's basically saying it's just that they are being competitively horrible about her in order to cement their roles in their group. I think she's being very generous and understanding, tbh!

That is mad. Milo Yiannapoulos is … a very … interesting character. Though I do agree that he should not be cancelled. He predictably managed to cancel himself with hardly any help at all. I forgot what sent him over the Edge though.

but how then does JB et al go full Circle to denounce KJK who set out transparently as plexiglass that she is a One Cause Woman and will use any platform to Get her point across? She says so on the tin. And I agree with her on that stance. That does not mean I agree with all those who platform her.
But I do believe in free speech, and Open debate and in not calling people dogwhistles and fascists just because you do not like what they are saying.
I also think it is a bad idea to dismiss all those who do not feminise to your detailed prescription, and call them domesticated zombies to boot. It is just super cringey. And encourages further polarisation. Just, why?

(Hilary Clinton shot the Democrats right in the foot in that awful, awful debate with Trump. And she looked so smug whilst doing it. I nearly cried. Trump was already pulling ahead and that was the nail in the coffin.)

That's completely what I can see, it's all competitive behaviour. Jordan Peterson would have a great time with this case study of lefty disagreeableness and sharp elbows jockeying for position.

Claiming it's because their morals are more morally moral or whatever is not fooling anyone.

Oh yes @reesewithoutaspoon I do apologize! ‘Allying’ these days is more accidently standing next to Bob the homophobe in the pub and not immediately pelt him with rotten swedes.

Soz to Bob the homophobe’s first inventor on this thread. I laughed so hard and then forgot who made that excellent post + the puppies 😂

If Starmer ejects her from PLP for this blatant racism I will be a bit encouraged.

It is exactly the type of 'divide and destroy' thinking she exhibits in this sentence that has turned me off the Left. I hope Starmer shows this has no more place in the Labour party than anti-semitism.

I forgot what sent him over the Edge though

This random capitalisation made me laugh out loud.
It reminded me of the time Apple forced a U2 album on everyone.

Autocorrect is fierce at present, I end up with all kinds of random apostrophes and capital letters. Trying to stop caring but it turns out it’s easier to tolerate being called a fascist than it is to ignore my own typos.

That is mad. Milo Yiannapoulos is … a very … interesting character. Though I do agree that he should not be cancelled. He predictably managed to cancel himself with hardly any help at all. I forgot what sent him over the Edge though.

He said some racist stuff about a black female comedian, and subsequently, he was mouthing off about sex between minors and older men being life affirming. I don't know if he meant it or was just trying to shock, but that's what got him cancelled. He is now claiming to be "ex gay" and advocating for conversion therapy. I mean, if KJK is guilty by association in the eyes of the head girls, what is Julie Bindel for sharing a platform with Milo?

It’s not just coconut.

I’ve seen a c word I haven’t heard since the 70s being used liberally towards people who aren’t being/thinking black, or brown properly.

It turns my stomach.

Milo is another pompous prick who turned out to be a massive loser rather than the devil incarnate.

In JB’s defence I think the tour was before the Ghostbusters release so likely before the Twitter bullying of Lesley Jones and the comments about underage gay sex (which Milo has since claimed were him minimising his own experience of what he now sees as predatory older men).

I CBA go double check the timeline because Milo is pretty irrelevant now.

Anyway, debate is good and JB doing so openly with Milo was interesting and quite brave at the time (and you can see they actually enjoy each others company through the jibing and sparring and crikey knows we need to lighten up all the pofaced politics a bit). I just wish that JB and others could extend a bit of grace towards Posie rather than taking up a stance that looks awfully like ‘fine for me but not for thee’.

I agree.

Truly horrible stuff.

And from people who claim they are anti-racist!

No. He spoke about sex/relationships between older gay men and teenage boys. From the perspective of being the young boy.

It was, I guess, his way of making sense of what happened to him. He was cancelled for not #metooing properly.

He was occasionally funny, and I think I caught a glimpse of the real man behind the character (personally I find there’s a brittleness to him, so I think public “Milo” might be the outer protective shell he uses to navigate the world) when he talked affectionately, and genuinely about Julie, when she wasn’t on the video/podcast whatever it was.

It is highly likely he instigated the legions of anti-semitic abuse Ben Shapiro got . I think Shapiro was the world’s most death threatened and hate crimed person on twitter for decent chunk of time. It might be tha Milo Unpronounceable is anti Semitic, but I suspect the motivation was he envy of Shapiro’s more “respect flavoured” success and status, particularly as Shapiro put his (Milo’s) nose out of joint for considering him intellectually woolly and inauthentic.

I thought the debate tour Julie did with him was a good idea, the ones I saw were entertaining and I got a sense they saw grow to see each other in more human terms, rather than avatars for their very different causes.

Bingo.

That winds all the threads together to make a nice cloth arrow pointing to cui bono from the current flame fest burning PP down.

Thank you, my head hurts less now trying to pull bits together so they make a non woolly sense.