Trans issues - just sad and disappointed

[Chasingthebutterflies]

Don't know what I want to say really. Haven't properly formulated my thoughts. Just came on to talk about it. Feeling a bit sad.

I was texting a friend (a man) about the recent case of the woman raped by a man in a hospital and the hospital's denial that she couldn't have been raped because there was no man.

My friend's response - the media wants us to think that all trans men are rapists, demonising the trans community, it's disgusting, it'll be us gays next.

I'm sad because there was no concern for the woman, I'm sad because despite my trying to explain that my issue is simply people with penises wanting access to spaces that are for people with vaginas only. Nothing to do with whether they are trans or not (a biological woman who lives as a trans man still accesses a female single sex space). Because it's not a trans issue. It's a male issue. I'm sad because I don't want to have to lie to my DC and say that a man standing in front of me is a woman. I want to be able to say that he is a biological male who chooses to live as a woman. But I want to be able to say that without being labelled transphobic. Because I'm not. There's no judgment. But there is a desire for safeguarding.

Just sad. Feels bonkers. Feels like I'm living in a big game of pretend.

These things probably shouldn't really be discussed on text anyway, but it has just made me sad and concerned.

I'm a long time lurker on here and I'm so angry about what's happened over the last week I have to post.

Solidarity to everyone who is feeling knocked and overwhelmed by the trans lobby and female abuse shitshow. My Twitter account is my freelance business so I feel I can't express myself on there. But the amount of times I've had to stop myself posting in the past few days...!

I'm so grateful for this forum as a safe space to vent. And for those who are brave enough to speak up without fear. Like many of you, I seem to be a lone voice in my circle. Even though none of this stands up to scrutiny or logic. The Lia Thomas situation is gaslighting on an audacious scale.

Even though none of this stands up to scrutiny or logic. The Lia Thomas situation is gaslighting on an audacious scale.

This is exactly how I feel. You're spot on.

Ugh. All day I've been seeing such horribly sexist and anti-scientific crap on SM, people now denying there's even a difference between men's and womens bodies, even advocating an end to all women's sports. I just despair!

About 30 years ago, when I was first working as a news reporter, I was put on a story about a middle aged man who had chopped his own penis off, because he'd been refused sex reassignment surgery. My job was to interview the medical team who'd reached the decision that he wasn't eligible.

I've never forget one specialist telling me that in over 99% of cases it wasn't that they really wanted to change sex - they just didn't want to be themselves anymore, didn't want their existing life anymore. They then got the idea that changing sex would completely change their life, solve all their problems in one stroke...he also said there was a very high incidence of those who had had the surgery ultimately regretting it. True gender dysmorphia was incredibly rare.

He also warned me, off the record, that this particular person was obsessive and dangerous, very mentally ill, and as a 'real' woman I shouldn't spend much time with him alone. He was pretty angry that my bosses had seen fit to send a early 20s, 5 foot 4 woman weighing 8 stone alone to interview someone 6 foot 4 weighing 17 stone...the person did end up stalking another woman who worked at the newspaper, and we ended up having to get a court order banning him approaching the newspaper offices or anyone who worked for it.

Of course nowadays we'd be told we were all transphobic...

@Chasingthebutterflies

Even though none of this stands up to scrutiny or logic. The Lia Thomas situation is gaslighting on an audacious scale.

This is exactly how I feel. You're spot on.

Latest gaslight from the Thomas camp is that Lia is no longer nearly six foot four in height as they were when they swam as a male, but have shrunk to a ladylike five foot eight . There will have to be some serious photoshopping on all the pictures of Lia with their female teammates, with female tv reporters , with former male teammates etc. The internet will have to close down for a week!

The height thing is amazing to watch play out on Twitter, and it's coming from the kind of people who naturally think themselves more liberal and progressive than the 20th century Communists who did this kind of thing all the time.

I can see why you'd want to be sure you're being as objective as possible, but really it's time to pick a side. Lia Thomas is one big fuck-off Trojan horse being welcomed inside the city by the witless, the cowardly and the opportunistic.

Oh god, that's so good. Perfect.

Latest gaslight from the Thomas camp is that Lia is no longer nearly six foot four in height as they were when they swam as a male, but have shrunk to a ladylike five foot eight . There will have to be some serious photoshopping on all the pictures of Lia with their female teammates, with female tv reporters , with former male teammates etc. The internet will have to close down for a week!

They what now. I am speechless. Is this the new thing we will have to pretend to believe? Trans women just look like they're 6'4, in actuality they are petite and dainty? And how dare you claim otherwise?

@RoyalCorgi

I can see why you'd want to be sure you're being as objective as possible, but really it's time to pick a side. Lia Thomas is one big fuck-off Trojan horse being welcomed inside the city by the witless, the cowardly and the opportunistic.

Oh god, that's so good. Perfect.

Thanks. I'm quite pissed off now and a bit fed up of "being kind".

Don't be unkind Lia is teeny. The guy is on his knees, the girl is a swimmer under 5ft and the ex swimming champion coach is really short. Hinest!

Honest? Obviously!

I've just read that Thomas is claiming to be 5'8" and weighs 60kg. Hahahahaha. I need aand it's only Monday.

It's surreal how people are talking themselves into complete nonsense saying stuff like there are actually no biological differences between male and female bodies. Wtf.

This LT size thing is the epitome of gaslighting. Don't you dare believe your transphobic eyes!

@WiseUpJanetWeiss

I've just read that Thomas is claiming to be 5'8" and weighs 60kg. Hahahahaha. I need aand it's only Monday.

Ok so that’s the same as me them. 🤐🤐🤐

@WiseUpJanetWeiss

I've just read that Thomas is claiming to be 5'8" and weighs 60kg. Hahahahaha. I need aand it's only Monday.

Man, all those male swimmers that Thomas is photographed with must be absolutely tiny .

Whodathunkit that Ivy League champ swimming guys would all be little pocket people?

Don't forget 75 male inches are the same as 68 female inches.

To be fair I don't think Lia has made any such claim, it is all the TRAs who are trying to gaslight everybody.

I've just read that Thomas is claiming to be 5'8" and weighs 60kg. Hahahahaha. I need aginand it's only Monday.

Whaaaaat? How weird! I just googled and yes there are official-looking pages claiming these stats, and also loads of others giving the 6ft-plus etc info, for both Lia Thomas and the pre-transition Thomas.

I suppose it makes as much sense as claiming to be female and it absolutely highlights the madness of the situation. So much so that I keep wondering if any minute Thomas is going to do a press conference and announce it was all a big publicity stunt, come out as GC and hand back the medals.

Oh and DS is also 5”8 - a bit under 60kg It also a swimmer. He can kick my arse in martial arts and pick me up.

@334bu

To be fair I don't think Lia has made any such claim, it is all the TRAs who are trying to gaslight everybody.

Yes I think you're right. May be a bit of an own goal?

"My argument is against the people who seem to assume that all trans women are by their very nature dangerous"
Well you should take that argument elsewhere then, because I've just read this thread from start to finish, and no one has said that. No one on this board thinks or says that. Are you deliberately missing the point? A hospital tried to cover up a serious sexual assault ffs. What is wrong with you that you don't think that's a problem?!

Safeguarding is transphobic? I don't think you've given this much thought. Seriously, just please think. This is about protecting women and girls from male violence.

Thinking is not really a thing for that poster. Regurgitating thought-terminating clichés very much a thing, though.

Another depressing day on the socials and in the news. Feels like we're in some dystopian parallel universe. I don't just mean the unrelenting anger and hatred over this, I mean the polarisation of every single issue. The bullying, the pile-ons, the rhetoric, the abandonment of reasonable discussion on ANY issue. That and the feeling of being constantly gagged for fear of being cancelled by people I know and like

I feel the same, FreeLanceFiona. The social media, in particular, is a cesspit these days, partly, because it is created to encourage anger and the resulting clicks, not reasoned debate.

The NHS rape case suggests to me that it is the institutional policies which should be kept in the main focus here. The victim of this rape was not kept safe and then she was further damaged by being disbelieved.

The overall gaslighting which comes about when debate is not allowed and when every term now has umpteen different meanings is wearing me down. So is the fact that empathy and kindness always go in only one direction when these issues are mentioned.

The use of 'transphobic' for anything short of unstinting support is extremely problematic, partly because it leaves no terms for real acts of hatred aimed at transgender people but also because it is used when a woman protests her own rights being taken away. This makes discussing the clearly clashing rights and demands for rights impossible.