FWR

[MarsScarlet]

FYI: I've name changed for this to avoid a pile-on.

This post is about the overwhelming negativity and hostility with the FWR board that new posters and posters with a differing viewpoint face if they attempt to use the board.

There is a persistent group within the board that are, to put it simply, hateful towards others. Despite posting there on and off for more than 4 years, I have never felt welcome, despite not holding any particular extreme views or being abusive to others. Without exception, I am accused of being another poster, or a man, a TRA, or some kind of paid activist. This occurs again and again until I leave a thread in frustration.

I’ve seen this happen to many other new posters. Few return. Why would they? Such an acidic atmosphere doesn’t encourage healthy discussion. I’d just like to discuss women’s rights, but this board makes discussion impossible.

I’m not exactly sure what the answer is, except for @MNHQ to request the board to tone down the rhetoric a bit and back off on any new names they may see on the board. Let people engage with you rather than actively drive them away.

Examples? Most posters aren't derogatory about transpeople, they just don't think they're gender identity changes their sex.

Do with that information what you will.

Kind of you to be so concerned that FWR puts people off.

There’s posters who go onto FWR and insist trans women are women and should be allowed into women’s spaces and sports with nothing else to back this up. There’s ploppers who post ‘you’re all transphobes’ with again nothing to back this up.

What tone/responses would you expect in those circumstances? What tone is allowed in your opinion?

So be clear on what your problem is!

Is it that we say they are not women? That they are male bodied? Men?

Because the problem is if we can't name trans women as what they are then we can't protect women's spaces.

Trans women are male and are part of the oppressor class rather than the oppressed.

Calling them any sort of women is precisely what has led to them believing they have the right to be in women's spaces.

But what OP and other people are saying is they are interested in FWR topics but they don't feel welcome in them.

FWR is mostly the Sex and Gender board. It's welcome to anyone who wants to discuss sex based rights, but as you note, no prisoners taken, partly because it's trolled and maligned constantly by trans rights activists and their friends. There's a lovely chat board where you can discuss other FWR topics too. Shame no one seems to want to do so.

There's a lovely chat board where you can discuss other FWR topics too. Shame no one wants to do so.

Yes, very strange considering how much they campaigned for one, and how vital they considered it to be!

There’s posters who go onto FWR and insist trans women are women and should be allowed into women’s spaces and sports with nothing else to back this up.

Some have done it on this very thread.

If you mean male pronouns for males abd female pronouns for females, I'm not compromising on that. It makes it startlingly clear what is going on when I use "he" to describe:

• A male swimmer or cyclist competing against women in a women's event.
• A male prisoner being jailed in a women prison.
• A female prisoner being sent to a male prison.

Likewise, I'm not compromising on talking about reproductive organs and reproductive role because reproductive role is at the core of all misogyny.

😂 it’s sort of a mumsnet filibuster.. though I’m not entirely sure what these people are trying to delay. Reality setting in, maybe.

Someone will start talking about ferrets next.

Yes, it's really quite perfect.

Secretly band together? No, of course not, that would be as absurd as someone making a spreadsheet of FWR users.

Do you think everyone saying this has decided to secretly band together and lie about it? Come on. They're saying it because it's true.

All five or so of them. Wow, that's so convincing.

<Coughs>
<shuffles feet>
<goes off to delete excel spreadsheet>

Mine was for perfectly legitimate reasons though!

I wonder if the soon to be legendary spreadsheet of fwr users has links to another spreadsheet of potential other usernames that each fwr user might be using on other threads. Hmm. Scintillating.

And there we have it you do want to police what other people say.

It's not policing what people say when you have the oral high ground, silly!

oral high ground? was that intentional, because if it wasn't, it was a perfect typo!!

I think you meant moral but oral works just a s well 😂

Ha, of course I meant moral. but it is kind of fitting!

Oh this is just comedy gold!! It really just keeps on giving.

It really is!

You're all unfriendly and hostile and can't keep a civil tongue in your head.

Oh! Delete, delete, delete...

Operation, blah blah blah, and all that

The list of FWR women is so reminiscent of the lists of Terfs that resulted in automatic block from TRA accounts on Twitter a couple of years ago.

I don't doubt it all. I suspect that Eden Palmer's "research" at Aston is a smokescreen for exactly that. Aston have access to the corpus linguistics toolsets to try to match disparate accounts together based on writing style and we know that the first scrapists already tried to do just that. I suspect that Mumsnet's namechange facility is what thwarted them the first time. Palmer's stolen scraped dataset could so easily be used to try to link usernames together for the purposes of "jigsaw" deanonymisation based on IRL information given on other boards or even lived experience disclosed on FWR. @BeckyAMumsnet @HebeMumsnet have you considered this possibility?

And everyone knows that I love to see legendary spreadsheets.

@ShireMaiden

‘I have a problem with the way they talk about trans people’

What, in as few words as possible, is your problem with ‘the way they talk about trans people’?

*it’s not transpeople, it’s men who tell us they are women. Trans women if you will. They should actually be ‘transmen’ - men who are transitioning, transitioning men therefore. Makes much more sense, logically. But we know logic bears no influence in gender woo, and we know language was hijacked by TRAs to make sure men were called women, long ago. But I digress.