DP’s self employed dream has become my nightmare

[BeLimeTiger]

My partner and I (I’m mid 40s, he’s late 40s) have been together five years, and he moved into my house almost three years ago. I have one DC (10) and he has grown up DC. He pays half the utility bills and a small rent contribution as I can’t have a grown adult living in my house for free. I was hoping that he’d use this as an opportunity to save so we could build a life together. I’m financially stable and have worked incredibly hard to pay off my mortgage so that I can have savings behind me and enjoy things like going abroad in the school holidays.

BF lost his well paid corporate job 18 months ago and decided that he wanted to be self employed. Unfortunately that hasn’t worked out, but he says that he will never work for someone else again. I can see he’s put a lot of effort in, and really seems to believe he’s onto something big. I value financial stability so the past 18 months have caused me a great deal of stress and he gets very defensive when I bring it up. He had some savings, but I suspect that he has burned through most of them.

I had so much hope for our future and I thought I’d finally found a proper grown up that I could build a life with. He was talking about buying a house together in the next couple of years which sounds pretty delusional. I’ve come to the realisation that he’s not someone I can trust financially. He’s got no financial security behind him and that worries me sick.

I’ve been looking at renting a small office a couple of days a week for extra private work (He doesn’t want me seeing clients at home as would find this intrusive) and he made a comment about what good value it is. He got really offended when I pointed out that the cost of this is half of what he contributes to live in my house and he found my comment emasculating.

He’s essentially a nice person, helpful around the house and generally easy to live with but I’ve been anxious about his work situation for well over a year. He was very offended when I said that this isn’t what I signed up for. I know he’s upset that I’m not more supportive but I just can’t help the way I feel.

I think this is the end for us. I’m so disappointed. Any similar experiences here?

This has been such a clean break! Which is fantastic but also quite strange for a couple living together for years… did you have no joint assets? Nothing that you’d purchased together? No plans in the diary that now need to be cancelled or changed?

It’s true though that many men compartmentalise and you are either with them or you aren’t - I couldn’t believe hows quickly my heartbroken ex H moved on - didn’t really even give me chance to ‘change my mind’ some women in fairness are like this too. I think it takes a certain mentality to cope with guys who are full of big ideas but can’t get traction, either through motivation or lack of any specific ability and are happy to plod along based on your efforts and I sense that isn’t your style OP - so yes it’s hard- but the right choice

We lived together for three years! No joint bank account and his name wasn’t on any of the bills, except the council tax. He cancelled the Netflix subscription the day he moved out and took everything he’d bought (like the coffee machine) with him. We couldn’t really plan things for the future because he didn’t know if he’d have any money

It's brought to mind a woman I heard telling her story on woman's hour years ago. She was a sahm, he was a big earner, apparently devoted family man.
In the space of a weekend he told her there was someone else, moved out, and cancelled the kids school fees. She and the kids were left penniless and homeless (house was tied to his work), had to move miles to find a rental and the kids into the local comprehensive where they were booked for their posh accents. I'm not a fan of two tier education, but what kind of dad does that to his kids? Wanted nothing to do with them from that moment on.

I’m reflecting on everything that’s happened and wondering what I can learn from this experience. I’m happy being single for the foreseeable, but there might come a point where I want to date in the future.

From what I’ve gathered from previous posts, this is what I’ve taken away.

• don’t date anyone from their late 40s with no assets
• have conversations about attitudes to financial security and values early on. It matters
• In my case I don’t really see myself living with someone again. Definitely not in my house anyway.
• Stop dating someone if it transpires that they have a very limited support network (NC with family members happens, but NC with family and only one friend is a red flag)
• People unable to initiate repair after conflict
• People unable to reflect on their part in a conflict
• Stonewalling. It’s never a one off, it’s a pattern

To add, I’m not in any way looking for a relationship. I’m just looking back and wondering what I missed. There must’ve been earlier signs which I ignored or minimised.

I think you should also look for patriarchal attitudes. This guy clearly saw you as a support vessel for him rather than as an equal partner, and you mentioned hat you'd noticed entitled and "I'm a Prize" attitudes previously. He also - when you ended things - did that classical rejected male thing of trying to demean you by saying you'd become a lonely old dog woman.

Looking for Burnt Haystack rhetorical patterns will help you pick up these attitudes if you decide to start dating again.

@BeLimeTiger

have conversations about attitudes to financial security and values early on. It matters

I'd extend that to conversations about literally everything, i.e. finances, sex, children, marriage, families, careers, pets, retirement, homes, etc. within the first few dates, and certainly before committing to each other in any meaningful/serious way. Yes, circumstances do change over time, but that should be relatively minor "tweaks" to your life plan, not complete changes in direction dictated by one partner without full agreement/support of the other!

It's always going to be a huge red flag if either partner won't talk about such things in any serious way. Any relationship needs good communication and you need to be "on the same page" in all things.

I certainly had some pretty in depth conversations when I started dating within the first 2/3 dates which included boundary setting. My first serious boyfriend started trying to break one "red line" boundary within the first few weeks and found himself dumped pretty quickly!

By contrast, my DH (of over 3 decades now) respected my boundaries, had boundaries of his own which I respected, and we've both followed the same "pathway" throughout our lives together, i.e. marriage before buying a house before children before setting up our respective businesses. We were on the same page with finances from day one as we have very similar financial attitudes, always openly discussed buying "big ticket" items even before we started living together as we were jointly "saving" for holidays, a house, marriage etc even though not living together, so we had organised joint finances at a very early stage.

When we both started our respective businesses (many years apart), we jointly agreed how much we'd invest, timescales for starting up alongside proper jobs (business work in evenings and weekends) and "trigger" points when we'd give up our respective proper jobs (i.e. if and when the business turnover/profits hit a certain level), and a mutually agreed "give up" point where it was clear it wasn't working and to write it off and give up and accept to continue working in proper jobs! Both our respective business ideas worked, in fact, both took off quicker than expected and we were both able to give up our jobs sooner than planned to go full time into our businesses when they were making profits higher than our wages. We both trusted each other, though, to give up on the dream, if things hadn't worked out.

You really have to have mutual respect your partner/spouse. That starts in the earliest days of dating. If you aren't on the same page from day 1 and can't properly communicate, your relationship is always going to be doomed.

Raise a big glass in celebration of having dodged a bullet.

I think even early days you can't believe much of what they're telling you because men lie a lot just to get what they want. They try to present some good picture of themselves. I think in my case slowing everything down would have helped immensely

I would also add, don’t let him know your attitudes and values first because a lot of narcissistic men simply tell you what you want to hear! for example ‘I love dogs. My partner would need to accept and love my future dog’ que the ‘oh absolutely, I adore dogs when actually they don’t. They don’t even like them and when it comes to the time when you’ve settled into a relationship and it’s time to get that dog you’ve always wanted, they will inevitably backpedal and say that’s not what they said, or their circumstances have changed or some other excuse. I made this mistake in my previous relationship. I told him what all my boundaries were and he faked respecting everyone of them until he didn’t. Going forward, I would always ask them early on to describe their values and attitude towards all the important things in life before they know anything about you. Questions like tell me how you feel about XYZ, tell me what your ideal relationship would look like in the future etc etc. They are much more likely to reveal themselves this way.

Did your friends and family like him? If not… red flag!

Did he pay you back for the holiday after you asked him for it?

and the dog… you bought everything for the dogs? Nothing together. I’m just surprised that over 3 years nothing at all purchased together that he’s not getting funny out.

The best thing about someone like this is that his daft pride will stop him from badgering you

Could you try not to be so hard on yourself? You're only human and none of this is on you.

This. It's on him. Women are not responsible for shitty, selfish, underhand men.

Enjoy your council tax single person discount!

Now this I totally agree on - get their values and lifestyle choices first

I agree @BeLimeTiger
When you first got together, his new life as a startup wasn't an issue. He gave himself very big PR buildup.
Being a fair and generous person, you gave him a chance. He blew it.
That is his fault, not yours.

On a lighter not.. Not long til half term!

Thank you. I just thought I’d done my due diligence when we got into a serious relationship. It wasn’t in any way a rushed relationship, he had a serious job, spoke very nicely about the mother of his children and he didn’t seem to over/under disclose. I liked his family (they weren’t NC then) and his children (who I met after a year of dating) seemed lovely and well adjusted. My family and close friends met him early on and found him to be warm and genuine. It really felt like I’d finally met my person!

I think you did do that @BeLimeTiger , but either he took a while to show his true self (which can happen), or he changed. Maybe he decided it was time he kicked back and let someone else do all the work. I ended a 2/3 year relationship this year. I really thought we would be together for the rest of our lives. Slowly he revealed his true self and he was also just looking out for himself and wanting me to do the heavy lifting. He knew what I was looking for and moulded himself to that, and then he grew more and more selfish. It's one thing ending a relationship after a couple of months, but it's really hard ending it after of couple of years when it's been really loving.

I hope you and DS have a lovely holiday.

OP I've been on holiday for a few weeks and have only just had time to catch up on your situation. Oh boy, have you been busy?😂Not only passed your exams, which is WONDERFUL news, but even better, you actually got shot of him pretty quickly, which I really wasn't expecting when I went away. I can't tell you how pleased I am that you've proved to be the strong woman that you sounded from your early posts, as it's easy to start off with good intentions, but a lot harder when you actually have to face telling someone that it's over, and then actually getting them out of the house. So I just wanted to say a HUGE congratulations, all around. Wishing you and your DS, a happy life from here on, and a wonderful holiday to relax and recharge yourself.

There’s an old expression that some people are for a lifetime and some for a season - and I think that’s correct- doesn’t mean they are bad people , just that you ‘fit ‘ at that point in time- and then for various reasons , you don’t- I think friends can be the same

Sending big hugs to you.

Thank you @MoonChild111 , I needed that hug x