The future for Muslims in the UK is "bleak and dystopian"

[Scirocco]

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2024/nov/17/muslims-face-bleak-and-dystopian-climate-in-uk-says-head-of-thinktank

According to a report by the Runnymede Trust. The crisis in Palestine and Lebanon is considered to be a major contributing factor.

Where have I excused aggressive behaviour?

You're making a point, I'm just trying to work out what it is.

That's a shame .

It beggars belief that some happily play down and minimise the experience of Muslims in the UK.
I don't think they would do this if we were talking about Jewish people or people of colour.
I am also sick and to tired for them to rank racism on a scale from not too bad to worst.

Really? I've seen plenty of minimising of antisemitism on here.

I am sure you have but two wrongs don't make a right as the saying goes.

Never said it does. But the whole "well nobody would ever say that about Jews" thing is tired old bullshit.

Just because you think it is "tired old bullshit" doesn't make it so. Shall I try criticising Jewish people (nor that I would because I don't conflate Judaism and what the Israeli government is doing) and see what happens? I can tell you I will be called antisemitic.

Yes obviously you would be called antisemitic. That doesn't mean no one undermines antisemitism on here like you claim.

How is a response to your question a deliberate obfuscation? You asked:
what other religion is at the centre of most war & conflicts across multiple countries at the moment?
Israel is at the centre of war and conflicts in several nations with the involvement of the UK and US, no?

Secondly I am unaware that Russia and Ukraine are at war over the Christian faith?
Of course not, I'm saying countries go to war and you aren't applying a religious cause to their violence. When Russia supported Assad, is that them also now becoming a Muslim country doing bad things because of Islam? Which faction did they become?

Britain and the US are continually getting involved where they should not as I pointed out in a previous post but they are not fighting for the Christian faith. Nor have they invaded a peaceful Muslim country ..They are there at the invitation of one or other of the factions (usually Shia vs Sunni) but often for their own perceived gain.

Don't recall the UK or the US being invited to many of them🤨but no of course they're not fighting for the Christian faith, that's the point. You (based on no actual logic or facts) are deducing that any conflict a Muslim country is involved in is caused by their religion despite the fact that countries of all other religions are just as violent and conflict obsessed but for them you don't deduce that their primary religion is the cause.

Please quote where I have "undermined" ( surely you mean minimise?) antisemitism.
You believe criticising Judaism is being antisemitic? Do you believe criticising Islam is being Islamophobe?
You are actually confirming my point here but I don't think you are aware of doing it.

Please point out where I accused you of undermining or minimising antisemitism.

You said that people would not minimise the experience of Jewish people or people of colour on here. They do, all the fucking time.

I think you fail to understand what I was trying to convey. I don't have the time and the will to explain what I meant.
Anyway, you should take Rutherford B. Hayes' advice, "Must swear off from swearing. Bad habit".

You said "It beggars belief that some happily play down and minimise the experience of Muslims in the UK.
I don't think they would do this if we were talking about Jewish people or people of colour.".

Whitish blatantly fucking untrue.

It's beggar's belief to me that you think pretending people don't minimise antisemitism and the experience of Jewish people is fine but the word fuck which is used on this website around once a minute is something to get worked up about.

Israel is at the centre of conflicts with 2 countries …. there are currently 11 conflicts involving factions of the Muslim faith. How are 2 vs 11 out of a total of 13 recognised conflicts not most? (Google amnesty or just current conflicts)

Russia are supporting one side of the war in Syria. The war wasn’t caused by Russia. The war was caused by a popular uprising of people against the leader. Russia have picked a side (for their own reasons) that doesn’t change the fact that the Syrian uprising is one of the people against the ruler with the spark being that Bashar Al-Assad’s Ba’athist government is being overthrow (or attempted to) by Islamist who want to reclaim Syria as a Muslim (Sunni) faith state. This That is the crux of the war? Are you unaware of that?

Britain and the US are constantly being invited into the conflicts. How is your knowledge of wars in the region so limited. I simply can’t be arse to inform you but google the atrocities perpetrated by Sadam Hussain’s Shia majority govt against the Sunni minority. Google Yemen, lebanon (their civil war rather than their conflict with Israel), Afghanistan, Nigeria, balkans…..I mean the list is literally endless.

Seriously - just google and read.

Oh but people do. Unfortunately racism against people of colour, antisemitism, islamaphobia, Russophobia are all real. Sometimes perpetuated by the same. Other times by different groups. And people experiencing discrimination can also discriminate

I’m not sure why it’s relevant to bring up other wars as though it absolves Israel of this war and these atrocities? Some of these “points” are downright weird. Just stop bombing people. It’s not hard. Just say “no more” and mean it.

One thing that intrigues me with the post out on this thread is that as pp have mentioned is that the Gaza war is a war with non Muslim effectively faced off with Muslims. There are other conflicts current and historical which involve Muslims attacking Muslims yet these were don't deserve MN spaces or specific sections of the media; why is that?

Why does demanding MN spaces never open a thread about them in MN?

I don't see the genocide in Gaza as religious at all to be honest. Yes, most Israelis are Jewish. Yes, most Palestinians are Muslim (though there are a significant minority of Palestinian Christians too, it being the birthplace of Christianity after all) but to me it's about colonialism and landgrab. I'm neither Muslim nor Jewish. I equally condemn anti-Semitism and Islamophobia unequivocally.
Also, on an individual level I feel exactly the same levels of sympathy and compassion for grieving Israelis and Palestinians who've lost loved ones. But, in a broader sense I feel especially moved by the Palestinian plight. Reason being that on a population level they've been living under occupation for decades, and in Gaza they're currently suffering ethnic cleansing and genocide. As a British person I feel a particular responsibility to speak out, due to Britain's history of colonialism, and due to The Balfour Declaration. Religion doesn't even come into it for me. I realise it does for many people, hence the recent rise in anti-Semitism and Islamophobia here and elsewhere. Both of which are inexcusable.
I'm actually a pacifist, and abhor all violence. It's all very sad for everyone affected in any way 😔

Why is there conflation of religion and race?.Islam is not a race but a relgion? If a group of racist thugs target Brown people that is racism not specifically Islamaphobia?

the original piece virus the fact that 33% of recently reported hate crimes involve the Jewish community and yet no mention is made who is commuting these crimes as it seems to harm the narrative this young woman is pushing?

But the article is about Islamophobia? Do you feel the same way about those articles that report antisemitism? That they should also report hate crimes from other religions?

I don’t want to distract from the conversation here but the link says that Jews experienced 33% of the hate crimes cited and muslims 38%. Muslims make up 6% of the population but Jews make up only 0.5% of the population.

Crimes against Jews happen at a significantly higher rate compared to crimes against muslims. The impression some have got here is that muslims are the most persecuted minority group but they aren’t. I think it’s important to put that in context before people start feeling they are being targeted in a way other groups aren’t. I’m not trying to minimise but to contextualise.

Having said that no-one should be facing discrimination on the basis of their religion.

I also do not think the genocide in Gaza is primarily to do with religion. It is territorial although with all genocides, racism underpins it. I do think the support from western countries or at heady failure to hold Israel accountable is partly due to islamophobia and racism sadly.

I agree with this, it's land grabbing with a hefty dose of racism thrown in. Western Countries support it because they have their own agendas. It makes me despair.