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Conflict in the Middle East
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94
Kosenrufugirl · 08/03/2024 05:07

We need to talk about it, thank you for posting

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 08:08

Biden gave a few more details of the proposed port the US intends to build in Gaza in yesterdays State of the Union address

It's going to be sited at Rimal near Port Gaza the only deep-water port in Gaza [destroyed by IDF some years ago] so will be suitable for large deep draught vessels

It's now being described as a 'temporary floating Mulberry harbour' and will be built by US forces marine engineers

It's going to take 'several weeks' to build and will be paid for by the US tax-payers

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 08:18

Can't find any nice pictures of Mulberry harbours - they were used in WW11 mainly in France - so most are just ruins now

10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne · 08/03/2024 08:18

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 08:08

Biden gave a few more details of the proposed port the US intends to build in Gaza in yesterdays State of the Union address

It's going to be sited at Rimal near Port Gaza the only deep-water port in Gaza [destroyed by IDF some years ago] so will be suitable for large deep draught vessels

It's now being described as a 'temporary floating Mulberry harbour' and will be built by US forces marine engineers

It's going to take 'several weeks' to build and will be paid for by the US tax-payers

Why can't Israel pay for it? It's their genocide.

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 08:37

10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne · 08/03/2024 08:18

Why can't Israel pay for it? It's their genocide.

Ha! It'll be pin money! US citizens will be proud

Wait til you see the bill that's presented for re-building Gaza!

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 08:52

Article about some of the problems with the US plan

Briefly

Israeli government will still be involved and can be obstructive

Timescale - too long for people starving now

What will happen to the aid once it arrives - who will distribute it? Who will protect it from looting? Where are the lorries to take it to where it's needed? etc

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/07/gaza-floating-port-aid-palestinians-impact

‘Who is going to distribute it?’: the key flaw in US’s plan to build aid port in Gaza

‘You need drivers, trucks and a distribution system that doesn’t exist,’ says president of Refugees International aid advocacy group

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/07/gaza-floating-port-aid-palestinians-impact

BelleHathor · 08/03/2024 08:59

10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne · 08/03/2024 08:18

Why can't Israel pay for it? It's their genocide.

Technically they will, in terms of reputational damage.

If this goes ahead it's America publicly distancing themselves from Israel, which allows more countries to do so.
Also would the IDF dare to bomb American ships again? Like the USS Liberty incident (https://history.state.gov/historicaldocuments/frus1964-68v19/d284)

Foreign Relations of the United States, 1964–1968, Volume XIX, Arab-Israeli Crisis and War, 1967 - Office of the Historian

history.state.gov 3.0 shell

https://history.state.gov/historicaldocuments/frus1964-68v19/d284

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 09:04

Exciting facts about Mulberry harbours with picture

https://www.ice.org.uk/what-is-civil-engineering/what-do-civil-engineers-do/mulberry-harbours

EasterIssland · 08/03/2024 09:06

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 08:52

Article about some of the problems with the US plan

Briefly

Israeli government will still be involved and can be obstructive

Timescale - too long for people starving now

What will happen to the aid once it arrives - who will distribute it? Who will protect it from looting? Where are the lorries to take it to where it's needed? etc

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/07/gaza-floating-port-aid-palestinians-impact

Thanks! I’ve opened a thread about this topic so will post it there if that’s alright

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 09:11

@EasterIssland of course no problem

10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne · 08/03/2024 09:56

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 08:37

Ha! It'll be pin money! US citizens will be proud

Wait til you see the bill that's presented for re-building Gaza!

I know it's going to be astronomical. I would like Israel to foot the bill and not the UN like the other times. Unlikely, but one can dream.

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 10:21

@10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne I saw a figure of 15 billion just to re-build housing a while ago which didn't seem very much to me [no expert] and there's been more destruction since then - and doesn't include hospitals, health centres, schools, universities, mosques, civic buildings, roads, disposal of rubble etc etc

The 'oil rich Gulf states' who usually contribute very generously to the repeated re-building of Gaza have said that they won't do it again this time unless they are involved in the 'peace process' and a 2 state solution happens - obviously Israel has had said no this

Israel has no money for re-building anything - even if it's economy wasn't wrecked it would never agree

anotherlevel · 08/03/2024 10:25

@Efacsen Israel has no money for re-building anything

Israel should have thought about that before bombing and destroying everything in Gaza really.

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 10:28

anotherlevel · 08/03/2024 10:25

@Efacsen Israel has no money for re-building anything

Israel should have thought about that before bombing and destroying everything in Gaza really.

But Hamas made them destroy Gaza - doncha know

10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne · 08/03/2024 10:33

anotherlevel · 08/03/2024 10:25

@Efacsen Israel has no money for re-building anything

Israel should have thought about that before bombing and destroying everything in Gaza really.

Agreed.

10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne · 08/03/2024 10:38

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 10:21

@10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne I saw a figure of 15 billion just to re-build housing a while ago which didn't seem very much to me [no expert] and there's been more destruction since then - and doesn't include hospitals, health centres, schools, universities, mosques, civic buildings, roads, disposal of rubble etc etc

The 'oil rich Gulf states' who usually contribute very generously to the repeated re-building of Gaza have said that they won't do it again this time unless they are involved in the 'peace process' and a 2 state solution happens - obviously Israel has had said no this

Israel has no money for re-building anything - even if it's economy wasn't wrecked it would never agree

It's good that they refused. Maybe it would be an incentive for Israel to get the two state solution underway once this war/genocide and the rebuilding starts to hurt Israel in the wallet.

anotherlevel · 08/03/2024 11:11

A peaceful protest led to a disabled woman in a wheelchair being moved by a police officer and causing her to fall off.

www.instagram.com/reel/C4LoOphoatu/?igsh=NmRkdmZuaXlwcGJo

Scirocco · 08/03/2024 12:10

I particularly like how the officer moving the wheelchair compassionately walks away after she falls out of it.

Parkingt111 · 08/03/2024 12:29

This was part of Biden's speech last night

"To the leadership of Israel I say this: Humanitarian assistance cannot be a secondary consideration or a bargaining chip," he said.
"Nearly two million more Palestinians under bombardment or displacement, homes destroyed, neighbourhoods in rubble, cities in ruin. Families out of food, water, medicine. It's heartbreaking."

anotherlevel · 08/03/2024 12:32

@Parkingt111 I don't know, he's saying some things that are right but he doesn't come across as genuine to me.

Parkingt111 · 08/03/2024 12:37

This is terrible if true. How did it happen?? I think @Efacsen mentioned that air drops could be dangerous for this reason
Did the parachute malfunction? Apparently 5 killed and many others injured

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/palestinian-reports-5-gazans-killed-when-hit-by-airdropped-us-aid-packages/

Parkingt111 · 08/03/2024 12:39

It does seem to be an accident but still extremely tragic if true

Parkingt111 · 08/03/2024 12:57

@anotherlevel I think it's a acknowledgement of his failure, but then again he has the leverage to use if he wanted to allow in more aid immediately through the crossings but he won't use it

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 12:58

@Parkingt111 all I know is that you need people on the ground to marshal the waiting people as far away as possible from the 'target area' for the drop so that this doesn't happen and that food aid by it's nature is dense and heavy

There was some film online from a few days ago of the large wooden pallets breaking up into smaller sections each with their own parachute - maybe this part went wrong?

It's like the mobbing of lorries and the proposed port definitely need trained people there to make sure it happens with the least harm to hungry desperate people on the ground

Saw earlier that there were 12000 people waiting for the aid convoy when it all went so wrong last week

,

Efacsen · 08/03/2024 13:14

Yesterday Turkey sent a ship carrying 3000 tonnes of food aid [largest amount so far from any nation in the war] this time it's heading for Al Arish in Egypt after the last large consignment from them got 'stranded' in Ashod thanks to the Israeli governments interference

Once unloaded the ship is going to turn round and collect another 3000 tonnes

There is just so much food around - it's beyond frustrating that it's not reaching the people who need it

Bit concerned tho' this huge 'stocking up' in Egypt isn't more contingency planning in case the border wall falls down