Please restore my faith in humanity..Israel?

[Bakensmile]

I don’t view Hamas as humans, they are pure evil.

However I am astonished at the atrocities Israel are committing and getting away with, I want to believe they are good and just defending themselves but it’s getting harder to do that. I have some questions if anyone could answer, I would be grateful. Before this gets deleted as that’s probably inevitable as mumsnet doesn’t like anyone questioning Israel.

Over 1,000 children have been killed since this all began. Why are Palestinian children’s lives not viewed as important as Israelis?

To the people who say Israel need to destroy Hamas. If Hamas had underground tunnels within Israel. Underneath Israeli homes, hospitals. Would you support the dropping of bombs and view the killing of innocent Israeli civilians as collateral damage and an unavoidable tragedy? Or do you think Israel, who has arguably the most efficient intelligence in the world, would find another way to obliterate them?

The UK and US wrongfully invaded Iraq killing thousands of civilians, some members of the army were raping women and in one case burnt a child alive. If at that time, Iraq had decided to bomb the UK killing thousands of civilians as a way to defend themselves, would you also support that?

The most recent tragedy last night at the hospital. Israel immediately took responsibility and were quite proud they had ‘killed terrorists’. They then deleted this tweet and backtracked saying it was Hamas, releasing audio between two members as ‘proof’.

How can they intercept phone calls between terrorists but failed to see the initial attack and massacre of innocent israelis coming? How is this considered as proof? The two people talking could be anyone.

Why would they claim responsibility if it was nothing to do with them?

What are the chances that a rocket misfires and just happens to land on a hospital that was supposed to be keeping hundreds of Palestinians safe?

Look at how many similar threads have been deleted. You were on the other one last night.

You carry on with your tit for tat juvenile posts.

There are reports of Israel putting cement into the water supply

are you condoning that?

atrocities have been committed for years I can’t believe how silent the media has been

@Wonkasworld there's many people on both sides who would like to continue the discussion

If you have an issue with it then just come off this thread

There's no need to report it
I'm sure many posters of both opinions do not want this thread deleted

Absolutely civilian casualties are terrible, this is why there was such condemnation when the UN found that Hamas had been storing weapons in schools and hospitals.

Of course Hamas was using a very targeted approach when it tied up innocent children and burned them alive sparking this latest offensive,

their rockets are less on point and 10% hit friendly targets which increasingly seems the most likely explanation re the hospital in Gaza

Lots of people want to discuss the issue, there are lots of informative posts.
You've been calling for the thread to be deleted for hours now. MNHQ have been on and it's (rightly) been allowed to stay, albeit with some posts removed.
I'm not trying to be rude or disingenuous in saying it may be better to hide the thread.

@Wonkasworld if you feel any of my posts have broken mumsnet rules then feel free to report them
I am quite sure I haven't. Iv condemned the action of killing innocent civilians by Hamas many times

I'm not sure which of my posts you are finding juvenile

You need to be extremely careful about spreading stuff like - check your sources. It is a well known propaganda technique.

That poster is just peppering this thread with snide digs rather than adding anything of substance.

I could put money on this thread going poof by tomorrow morning.

@Maatandosiris it has indeed happen
Israel claim it is because the Wells or water supplies have been dug without a permit or according to their guidelines
Palestinians argue it is very difficult to get a permit

@Maatandosiris

This is from an Israeli source. So ofcourse there will be some bias and justification for doing so, but it did happen. It wasn't some sort of fake propaganda

https://www.timesofisrael.com/settlers-from-flashpoint-west-bank-settlement-said-to-torch-palestinian-field/

What have you added, aside from a "snide dig"?

@Maatandosiris

Just about any connection between Areas A and B must go through Area C where Israel retains all powers and must consent to any Palestinian drilling for water. The Civil Administration panel that signs off on such projects does not have any Palestinian representation. Even the diameter of the pipes approved for Palestinians is a third of the size of the ones used by Israel

Source Times of Israel

Israel maintains that it has a right to crack down against illegal Palestinian construction of homes and infrastructure in those areas, while Palestinians point out that they have no choice but to build illegally to account for natural growth since Israel very rarely approves permits for them. Indeed, the Israeli minister now in charge of the Defense Ministry authorities who adjudicate such permits is Bezalel Smotrich, a long-time advocate of annexing Area C.

I haven’t. But you clearly have an agenda but are just leaving small comments on many people’s posts rather than expressing a view of your own. It’s odd.

Thanks for sharing.

But this is why it’s imperative that all the threats to Israel are removed esp the terrorist jihadists. Only then can things move forward. As I said up thread this is the only way to de escalate. Jews need to feel safe to give those in Gaza the ability to build things such as desalination plants.

israel won’t sit back whilst they’re under threat. It’s stalemate atm. We’ve seen what happens when Hamas get access to Jews.

of course no one wants to see ordinary people in Gaza suffer. But in order to enable moderate governments on both sides there needs to be a removal of threats to the existence of Israel, whilst that exists there cannot be a de-escalation.

The process needs to start by all sides agreeing that current areas remain (these follow the geography of ancient areas so aren’t arbitrary.

once this is agreed it will remove some of the tension and ordinary people on both sides will be a lot safer.

I'm making observations that are of a similar theme during the last couple of nights. I've also made some comments of a 'substantial' nature. You haven't but you appear to have just picked out my posts. You were also passive aggressive rather than directing your dig to me.

@Maatandosiris I agree with some of your points to a certain extent but from that article you can see there is clear discrimination towards the Palestinians
It also notes how not alot is done about settler violence against the Palestinians. This is another issue that gets brushed under the carpet. What I do know though is that some ordinary Israeli civilians also oppose many of the extreme settlers and also criticise the lack of law enforcement on their crimes by the Israeli government

True

In other news whilst Israel continues to withhold water from the Gaza Strip 60% of children have diarrhoea due to the unsanitary conditions
Source sky news

Gaza is a health crisis on the brink of explosion'We've been focused a lot on diplomacy efforts and geopolitics today as Joe Biden travelled to Israel and protests erupted across cities in the Middle East.
The other side of this story is the worsening situation for the people in Gaza.
At one shelter, a charity has said, 60 percent of children have diarrhoea due to a lack of sanitation in the region.
Action Against Hunger said a lack of access to water is "one of the biggest challenges" in Gaza right now as its humanitarian crisis worsens and children are "most at risk" from the health consequences.
Overcrowded shelters are "close to breaking point", it said.
"One such shelter is currently supporting more than 24,000 people - with 60% of children there affected by diarrhoea," the charity said.

I honestly find it so difficult to comprehend how people are still condoning this inhumane siege of Gaza by Israel where it seems the ones who are suffering the most are innocent children

I find it hard to believe that people are really questioning that Israel bombed the hospital. Idf literally posted a tweet saying they did and then when the media started talking about it, they quickly deleted and denied it. Their usual tactics nothing new really, although heartbreaking. Just shocked people believe it's a "hamas rocket misfiring"

I think though whist blame is being flung around nothing is going to move forward.

What is clear is that terrorists need removing from the equation. The land needs to be split and the most obvious a way to do this is along the lines of ancient kingdoms. Kingdoms which existed before Jews were exiled and persecuted (coincidentally roughly where things are now).

Once it is clarified borders aren’t moving then work needs to be directed towards making sure neither side is threatened by the other. Egypt could play a vital role here, but again is unlikely to until the terrorists are gone and there is consensus in the Arab world that the boarders of Israel are protected.

Also can we talk about all the humanitarian aid that's been waiting at Rafah crossing at the Egyptian border for 5 days? Because Israel is not allowing them in and children in Gaza are literally starving and have no access to drinkable water. I can't see any justification for Israel's actions at this point. They want to wipe the whole area out.

So it's just "Jews" that are persecuting Palestinians is it? None of the non-Jewish citizens of Israel are guilty of this are they, and not just Israeli Jews but, all Jews regardless of where they're from?

This is either incredible ignorance, blatant antisemitism, or deliberate goading.