To cancel a day out over breezy attitude?

[MaybeOverthinkerNightmare]

Not sure if im being unreasonable here or expecting a little too much as I struggle to make friends and feel a bit disheartened with this situation.

I'm off work this week and have some childfree time to myself. I asked a friend if they fancied doing something like go fo a walk. They took a while to respond but eventually with a backhanded comment "sure a walk tomorrow then, what time?", I responded with a time and meeting place which was read and nothing further. We are due to meet tomorrow and haven't heard anything more from them since then.

A similar thing happened a few weeks ago when i invited them to lunch, had a great time (i paid) and went for an hour walk afterwards. Then I got ghosted or semi causal/vague responses to messages after that. I feel a bit disheartened that i get a sense they are just not interested and trying to placate me.

This has taken a lot of effort for me to put myself out there and make friends, instigating more rather than being led. I guess thinking a little enthusiasm or reciprocation would be nice but am I expecting too much? Is this actually how friendships are? Should I cancel and just move on from this situation?

You're right it doesn't add much but it all seems a bit utilitarian and careless, that's all. Maybe one could hope for more from a friendship but maybe this person doesn't value the OP ... something she is clearly thinking about. I'm half with Golden Leaf and half with Cosimarocks in that I think there is something in the brevity and sparseness in the way one texts that means something but also I wouldn't judge the relationship entirely on that but for me, it is a factor.

Think I am like your friend OP. I am crazy busy. All the time. I feel like every minute of my life is assigned to something. I’m always on and speaking at work so quite often I have zero energy or desire or idle chit chat in a message. I’m like this with DH too. It’s practical. “What time are you back?” - no “hi” or “how are you?”. It really isn’t personal, it’s simply a means to get info. I engage when I actually see them. I also take forever to reply. Sometimes I can take days. My friends all know I’m like this. I am very drama free so I truly mean nothing by being like this.

Perhaps your friend is a bit like me?

Try not to worry about it too much.
I think I am maybe like your friend. I’m not keen on texting- only the bare minimum.
I would enjoy the walk and chat with you and that would be it until the next time.
Just see if your friend turns up. If not don’t waste any more effort on her.
If your friend is like me then she prefers friendship with a light touch to start with. A deeper friendship may grow over time.
Good luck!

I had a "friend" like this. If I made contact and asked her to meet for lunch or something she would agree and we met, but she never initiated anything. Also if we had lunch I noticed she didn't divulge much about what she was doing/planning etc. So in the end I stopped asking her and she never contacted me again. (That was 5 years ago, so I doubt she'll do it now !
People like this are just too much hard work.
I'd spend time with/give invites to people who appreciate your company.

This!

Its hard to advise when I dont know know the other person. But on the surface of it.

Friend sees you when you suggest. You'd suggested a walk, theyd then asked were you not busy as they know youre on some leave. You say no im free at such a time and thumbs up is agreement.

Theres nothing negative from them there. They could just be busy. I have a friend like that, takes ages to reply, communicates mainly in thumbs ups and messages that say "ok" or "see you then" but its great when we meet in person.

I think dont read too much into a WhatsApp unless its awkward in person or its just you shes like this with

My issue is I don't feel great being the one to always opening up conversation or always planning to meet. I dont just want to be the friend being responded too all the time.

I understand that, in a long term close friendship - but this isn't that, it's a new friendship. Where did you meet this person? Because unless it was at a designated event the main purpose of which is to make friends, then I think it's safe to assume that you're the one wanting the friendship in the beginning and the other person can take it or leave it. Once you become established friends that's when I'd expect to see a bit more effort, if the other person actually was bothered about being friends.

Even if they remain take it or leave it about the friendship it doesn't mean you have to drop them, just accept that it'll never go past casual and don't prioritise them. With those more casual friendships, if you get a better offer and can give a few days notice to cancel (ie you wouldn't be being flaky or rude with a last minute cancellation) then cancel the casual meetup and invest your energy into the more enthusiastic friend.

I personally hate "hi, how are you?" texts with no further information. They're usually sent by people like you (sorry!) who don't want so much to know how I am, they want me to engage them in conversation about how they are. It pisses me off and makes me feel like they want me to entertain them. I mean, if you have something to say, some news to impart, something to ask, then just say it!

Unless I'm unwell or going through something and my friend knows this, then I don't expect to be asked how I am unless we haven't been in contact for months. If you saw me last week and I was fine, then why would I not still be fine?

I'm totally happy to chat via text when I've got time and in an established friendship, but I don't invest that level of energy into new people because so many people these days want friendships that are 99% messages and barely ever meeting up, which is a type of friendship I'm not interested in. So I want to know that the meetings are semi regular, we're definitely friends and that they're not a flaky last minute canceller type before I start spending time chatting via text. And even then I won't initiate a chat unless I have something to say, I'll never send a "hi, how are you?" unless I know they've been ill or are going through something.

Long text chats take up more time than you'd think. If I've got time for that, I've generally got time to meet for a quick coffee, so I'd suggest that instead of starting a long chat over messages. I find if I'm having a long ongoing text chat with someone I barely get anything done that day/evening until the chat is over. And I've always got a long list of things to do, I'm not sitting around scratching my butt and wishing someone would text me 🤷

I don't think you're needy as such, just that you could be coming off as too intense. And not accepting that at least in the beginning a new friendship is going to mean more to you than it does to the other person - because you're the one looking for friends, not them.

You've got to give time for the friendship to develop. At the moment you're trying to go from 0 mph - 60 mph in one meetup. Like the friendship equivalent of having a one night stand - and then assuming the person is your new committed partner who isn't going to look at anyone else and wants to see you several times a week and spend all their weekends with you. Just relax a bit and let friendships bloom slowly. Otherwise you risk scaring people away.

This is so mad! I mean, this woman never required you to initiate contact. I assume you wanted more contact than she did, if she never initiated — that is just both people suiting their own preferences. If you wanted to see her, you weren’t somehow doing her a favour. You chose to do the ‘work’ of contacting her, of your own volition.

And she’s entitled not to give you chapter and verse on her doings, if it didn’t suit her. You just had different ideas about disclosures.

OK.

You aren’t expecting too much OP. People make excuses for shit friends all the time on here. If people can’t be bothered to stay in touch, they can’t be surprised if you decide to discontinue the effort.

Have some boundaries OP.

No. It’s not mad. It’s people not putting effort in and taking people for granted. You’re obviously one of those types.

You asked if it worked

Your friend 👍 to show it worked.

You friend will turn up at the place and time you requested. Have a lovely walk.

Some people aren't great via messages - so I'd judge more based on the real life interactions you have.

I think we all feel a bit hurt when offers of friendship aren't reciprocated or turn cold over time - yet I think most of us accept that, when dating, not everything will work out everytime? This is something I try to remind myself; not gelling with one person is not a sign you're deficient in some way!

I do really feel for you, OP, as I have mostly surface-level friendships and flip between trying to develop closer friendships and overthinking things. Currently having similar feelings to you re someone I met with a similar aged toddler, who was initially keen to meet up regularly but has recently cooled off and declined to make plans for any time soon with a reason that wasn't really a reason (not that she had to give one of course, but it felt quite awkward replying to her message).

It's very hard. One thing I have found is that it can be easier to slot into a group dynamic - shared hobby/group of other parents - if what you are looking for is company and a chance to chat. It doesn't guarantee deeper friendships, but I find it gives me enough social engagement and gets me out of the house regularly and although I'm somewhat on the fringes of the group I've joined, I have been made to feel welcome so far.

Not sure how old your child is, but I have heard Peanut is a good app to meet other mums (possibly more for mums of babies but maybe worth a try?)

I read a a piece of advice once and it's helped me. Imagine that 10 steps separate any two people from being closer.

Take the 5 steps but no more, because otherwise you'll end up going to taking step 7 and 8 towards them and be disappointed and hurt, and it's not a balanced harmonious friendship.

If you've met the person halfway, leave the rest to the other person.

The no other plans comment sounds like she thinks she’s your back up option if you don’t have anything else to do. Have you thought about why she might feel like that?

And this. She’s said yes. What else do you need?

What sort of a follow up were you expecting?
Maybe I am far too old but I remember the days when you would make a plan with a friend, told them place and time and then you just went there and hoped they would show up. It did not take a week of back and forth messaging to confirm, a barrage of memes or updates on when they left the house and traffic conditions on M5.
I made a plan with a friend to visit on the 24th of October. I guarantee you that we won't be messaging each other between now and then. I simply assume she will come on the agreed date. There might be a message on the day to say what time she gets here. This is a close friend and we will have a great time.

a thumbs up is the reply. You are being WAY too needy with messaging sorry. Lots of people don’t want to be glued to their phones.

"similar thing happened a few weeks ago when i invited them to lunch, had a great time (i paid) and went for an hour walk afterwards. Then I got ghosted or semi causal/vague responses to messages after that"

Maybe they're happy to have a casual meet up now and then but don't want all the texting etc inbetween?

Don't bother chasing up, you'll know where things stand if the friend doesn't get back to you. If you let them initiate contact then you'll be abke to gauge what level/frequency of contact that they're happy with.

If they would rather do something else, they would be doing it. As it stands, they agreed to go on a walk with you. Why do you think they'd that if they didn't want to?

It’s your messaging style that’s too intense. Lots of people want genuine real human connection, you get that from meeting face to face. No one builds friendships via phones, it’s just a way to stay in touch between meeting up. If you’re going to ditch this woman as a potential friend just because you like messaging her more than she likes messaging you - then that’s really sad.

Some people like using their phones lots to message, others don’t and that’s fine. It doesn't have to impact the friendship.

Perhaps the friend is trying to model her own boundaries; she's happy for the odd meet up but doesn't want to text all the time, and so this is her showing what her boundaries are, by giving just as much time as she's able or willing to give to OP.

I read the ‘no other plans’ as she was bored by the idea of a walk and wanted a meal as well. She owes OP a meal, she could have suggested it, but she has just agreed to a walk in a bit of a lacklustre way as presumably she only wants a meal if it’s paid for. That and never initiating meeting with the OP or asking how she is…no I don’t think she’s particularly keen.

Obviously that could all be wrong as the comment is pretty ambiguous and the messages so short. So OP will just have to go on the walk and see how they get on this time.

Exactly. I meet friends and family for a walk frequently. No participants expect huge enthusiasm or repeated confirmation!

With kindness, OP, you are expecting too much of people. I don't mean you shouldn't expect to be treated well or have standards, but you're expecting people to be too emotionally connected, far too soon. It's unrealistic.

You are expecting people to read your thoughts and service your emotional needs in a way which most people, frankly, don't have time or energy (or emotional capacity) to do even with a spouse or partner, let alone with a friend.

Most people don't want this level of intensity from a friend, certainly not from an acquaintance. It puts a level of pressure onto the relationship which becomes very draining and unsustainable. I'm telling you this not to be harsh but because I've been on the receiving end of behaviour like this from friends and invariably it makes people feel stifled and pressured and is unsustainable.

If you get upset because she hasn't responded to a text in a way which meets your emotional needs, you are expecting her to devote far more emotional labour to this than she has and it's not going to be fun for her, it's going to seem like huge pressure.

You've talked about wanting to learn to be more casual and surface level: that's part of it but I think you need to learn to reframe the way you look at friendship and acquaintanceship and learn to go with the flow more. Very few people want those sorts of demands placed on them by friends.

Every person whose company you enjoy is a potential friend, but they are not obliged to immediately mirror your every emotional need from day one. Learn to take it as it comes, be open to friendship but don't over-invest. You're far more likely to build friendships if you minimise demands on people in the early stages.

I think you'd benefit from some counselling. But in the short term, learn to take things more slowly, more casually, and dial down the emotional expectation.