Refuse holiday for youngest as eldest half-sister excluded even though has impact on childcare

[MarieBaronelovechild]

My parents in law told my husband that they were taking all the kids for a week’s holiday last week of August. This would be amazing, the kids would see their cousins and we would not have to juggle time off and save money on the music camps when we haven’t been able to take time off.

Last Tuesday BiL met husband, it turns out all the kids doesn’t include my daughter from my previous marriage.

BiL says that MiL is prepared to take her as she doesn’t want to upset us but BiL asked if we can have a bit of a rethink next year as MiL and his kids and presumably SiL’s kids, don’t get to see youngest without eldest so disrupting relationships. .

DH still wants to send her with them as MiL is prepared to take her. I don’t and don’t want my youngest going either.

This is Mumsnet, eldest has a father, sees him and he pays for her, more than he has to but can’t take time off in the summer.

My AIBU

Upset with in-laws’ attitude
Not prepared to send eldest on holiday with them.

They can feel how they like underneath but people who make a nine year old feel like an outsider are not kind.I’d stay and watch a friends child and clap and support never mind a step grandchild

What has that got to do with anything?

Agreed I wouldn’t let my eldest DD be in their company because there will always be thngs to make her feel othered. Their choice. Mine not to her through it. DH could take younger DD to visit when ever he wanted but I wouldn’t let her go away with such mean spirited people even if they are her GPs

The father of the eldest is not in a blended family with the youngest child, so it's not expected for him to have any sort of relationship with her. The opposite is true for the oldest, she belongs to her stepfathers family unit and has lived with him since she was 3. Its not even comparable, I've no idea why people bring this up in every blended situation. The ex husband is not even in the blended equation.

It gets brought up so mean people can feel
justified for being mean to children.

So you made the decision she’s not going. You know how they feel about your dd. Now you need to try to figure out how you are going to manage the relationship with in-laws going forwards.

As someone who has DDs who have been half/ step sister to both exh wives after me and through me and my dh so we have a lot of good and bad experiences.
in your situation I would want to pull my relationship with ils back and also eldest dd relationship with them. I would encourage dh to take younger dd (when elder dd is with her dad) but only occasionally join in (enough to be polite, little enough to not be mistaken for closeness ) I would also be very clear to my dh that I am disappointed in his actions and his choosing of his extended family over his step dd. I would try to forgive him for the sake of the kids though. I would try to shield my dd from it as much as possible and role model a detached relationship with in laws so she doesn’t feel like she is the one being pushed out but rather that you are choosing not to be close.

how many children are your in laws taking away and where to? I would be more concerned about the logistics of that and whether they can safely look after them all!

They are all being completely out of order to say the cousins should be able to spend time with your youngest without your eldest there - that’s her sister - you can’t just pretend she’s not there because they are not blood related. I would be fuming at that. What do they propose you do with her when they meet up?

The youngest has as much right to spend time alone with her family as the eldest does with hers. How is that being mean? You seem happy for the 4 year old to not have any 1 to 1 time with anyone.

Because of course the only way the youngest could ever have one to one time with grandparents is on a holiday with… oh wait, how many other children are going as well?

You seem really determined to defend the exclusion of children from group events.

I'm with you, OP. And I would be arguing with my husband over his decision to try and send your youngest.

People can say extended family don't have to respect step/ blended relationships. And they don't- but there are consequences to that.

Just as extended families should generally accept spouses (i.e. not blood relations), so I believe they should accept any step children who come with them. They might not feel exactly the same way about step grandchildren but it's inexcusable to treat two children of the same family group in such different and obvious ways. Especially when they have known her so many years.

I've seen this play out in my own family - we're a double blend i.e. each brought children into the relationship and now have a 'joint' child too. My parents and sister do their very best to include my stepdaughter. Birthdays and Christmas are the same, and they would not invite my biochildren on a trip and exclude my stepdaughter.

My husband's family, on the other hand, have not done very well with this and as a result (combined with some other issues) we don't see much of any of them. My husband says they are not respecting his chosen family I.e. his stepkids and while you can't force love etc, you should at least try to appear like you are treating them equally.

BiL says that MiL is prepared to take her as she doesn’t want to upset us but BiL asked if we can have a bit of a rethink next year as MiL and his kids and presumably SiL’s kids, don’t get to see youngest without eldest so disrupting relationships.

I am not really clear quite what is being said here. Whose idea is it that it would be better if your DD did not go? - MIL or BIL? In what way might your DD disrupt relationships?

i don’t think they have asked that OP’s eldest is never at family get togethers, visits or parties. They do want to do something things- like a holiday- with their grandchildren.

I imagine the older DD spends time with her father and his family. Furthermore, I would think she is quite well aware that her younger sister’s grandparents are not, in fact, her grandparents. If op and her DH were to split up, I doubt OP would have expected them to keep in contact.

My own siblings step-child is quite capable of understanding that our parents are not his grandparents and I don’t think he wants them to be, or to have that sort of relationship with them because he has his own parents and grandparents. He doesn’t call them granny and grandpa- he calls them by their names. I am also referred to by my name, and his step-father is not Dad- he has a Dad and he doesn’t need a second one. He is certainly treated nicely and is included in family parties/ weddings/ Christmas celebrations etc (which he doesn’t always come to as he sometimes has plans with his family), but he is not treated exactly the same as biological grandchildren/neices & nephews in all things. He obviously gets birthday and Christmas gifts in the same manner as my niece and nephew, but he hasn’t received larger gifts from my parents that his younger siblings have had (e.g. driving lessons being paid for, contributions towards a first car, or help with university costs, for example) and he will not receive an inheritance from them directly. He has 2 parents and 2 sets of grandparents to provide these things, he doesn’t need his step-fathers family to do it (and I’m not entirely sure his parents would welcome them doing so either).

My parents have done things with just their grandchildren at times- and why not? just as he does things with his family without his siblings. None of them are upset at being left out when the other sibling is off doing something or away without the others- they accept it happens and think very little of it. It could be an issue, if you turn it into one, but it could also be managed for more simply by being matter of fact. It’s a case of “ you go do things with your dad/ paternal granny and grandpa without your sister, and sometimes she does things without you too, and both is ok”.

It’s not unkind, it’s recognising that step-families can be perfectly kind without being exactly the same. OP has said until this her PIL have generally been kind.

Younger child has no relationship with older child's father. Younger child's father however is older child's step-father, they live together as a family unit. Can't you see the difference?

All of this.

Also the more I look at the OP, the more I think that if the inherent problem is 'childcare and costs', then it's all the wrong priorities anyway. Whatever it costs to look after your own children on holiday is very much your responsibility - grandparents or step-grandparents aside. So being worried about paying for camps and logistics isn't a positive starting point.

Maybe I could engineer it when eldest is with her dad.

This is the way most people would do it, I do think their ambiguity about the holiday was thoughtless of them, but they obviously just didn't think, because they don't ever think of her, your updates show that there is a history of that, so it shouldn't really have come as a surprise and it should absolutely have been clarified immediately, rather than assumed by your DH.

You've just confirmed that your eldest was taken on a holiday to Portugal by her dad, so there is always going to be things that the children do separately and may seem unfair on the other one, it is just something they will come to accept and it is the perfect example to explain it to your eldest DD.

I think it is good that they have been honest with you in fairness, so now you know the worst thing you could do is continue to force an relationship between DH family and your eldest daughter, to try and make it the same as their relationship with your youngest, at best it sounds like it will only ever be one of tolerance, so unless it is a situation where you are all there together naturally, you don't need to sign your child up for a lifetime of feeling inadequate by people who ultimately are nothing to them, you can protect her from it by stopping trying to make it happen.

I would never look at them the same way though personally.

No I can't in my blended family we absolutely wouldn't expect this of one part of one child's family. The oldest is not their grandchild and has her own paternal grandparents

I don't get this to be honest and wonder why people always trot it out.

Why would the family of the eldest ever have anything to do with their youngest? They would never have any occasion to even meet let alone frequently get together, she isn't part of his 'household'. The dad takes his child away from OPs household for his contact time, and would never be expected to take the youngest child who is not his, why on earth would he, she doesn't know him from Adam.

However OPs eldest child is a part of her husbands household, she is his step daughter, she lives with him and they have blended their family unit, if there was a family occasion on OPs DH side.. she will be in attendance as a member of DH household/family, I can understand them not wanting to have contact with her on their own for the reasons you say, but rejecting her joining family occasions even though she is part of their son's family is awful behaviour.

Weird people think these two things are comparable?

It’s just a go to on the basis why would you expect a grandparent of one child to basically really care about the other non related. It’s not fully logical for obvious reason but should make clogs turn a bit.

If op suddenly found her self divorced the current dh’s parents wouldn’t spend a penny or second with her dd1 just as like currently her ex and his parents spend not a second or penny on her dd2.

Why can dd1 have alone time with her parent and extended family but dd2 is expected to always have dd1 tag along.

In these family situations ok gets invited because she is their son’s wife. It’s a curtesy invite on its own. They then see her child as exactly that. Son’s wives child. So she isn’t on the radar when planning things with the children or even grandchildren because she isn’t seen as family neither is op but she gets the Curtesy invite as wife/girlfriend.

You’ll see some families will work out their child’s step child’s parenting time and will deliberately plan their family events on their time with the other parent.

This holiday is granny wanting to treat her grandchildren. The ops dd1 isn’t her grandchild not on radar.

The problem is there isn’t a black and white answer there are some situations where it’s actually cruel to leave the child out (like this one) and there’s some where it’s absolutely reasonable for the child to not be considered a family member.
for example
A women meets a man, he has two children 11 and 13 who he sees once a month. The in-laws meet these children occasionally maybe 4 times a year for a couple of hours. It’s pretty reasonable that the extended family do not see the child as a family member.

A women has a baby 18 month old when she meets a man. Baby’s dad is not on the scene. They have another child a couple years later. Both children live in the family home and spend equal time with dgps. It would be pretty mean to not try to bond with the child in this scenario

Every situation is different but for people who are going from their own experience of step siblings they need to consider if their situation is anything like this one.

Yhis is neither of those scenarios but it’s closer to the second one of the two.

No, the personal circumstances of the parent with the previous child and their paternal family does not have any bearing on the new in laws to have to get involved. They are not required to assume the roles of actual people who are missing from the child’s life, unless they voluntarily choose to. This is the whole issue. People outside of the IL’s make assumptions on their behalf.

I’ll honestly never understand how anyone can have a child, marry someone else later and demand that they treat your child from a previous relationship the same as the children you have with your partner. The gall of it, to be honest!!

Your youngest deserves a holiday with her family. No one is owed a free holiday or childcare. I would send her and find something else lovely for your daughter to do, perhaps with your side of the family if possible?

But why does the wife get invited to anything as they are also not blood related? And they may split up and she may never speak to the in-laws again. Friends , why bother developing a close relationship in case it peters out? Probably risky to date as well and maybe steer clear of family because actually blood doesn’t tie people to each other literally only metaphorically

I wouldn't do what they'd do but it's not quite the same. Even if OP splits from her husband, she'll still be the mother of their grandchild. And yes, eldest is the sister of their grandchild but isn't going to be involved in custody arrangements etc etc if they split.

If they did split, they could easily literally never see eldest again. Sounds like they wouldn't want to, either!

And I guess they probably think they will tolerate OP because their son chose her, but the child is excess?

Like I said, it wouldn't be me so I'm speculating but it's different. And people directly benefit from their friendships and romantic partners. More importantly, they choose them. His family hasn't chosen eldest and clearly aren't shy about making that obvious!

I can't imagine not caring at all about a child I'd known since they were a toddler, but some people are just built different.
This is why blending families is such a minefield and when adults are entering into these arrangements, they should really think about how they will manage scenarios where the children are treated differently. Or whether it's a good idea to put their dc in these situations in the first place. The couple need to be very clear that they are on the same page about how they want all the kids to be raised and should talk to their own extended families, so that no one is getting a nasty surprise down the line.
If OP had known her Dh wasn't going to be that bothered or that her in-laws wouldn't bond with dd1, she might have made different decisions around exposing her dd1 so much to the in-laws - she might have managed dd2 seeing them when dd1 was with her own dad, thus sparing them both the expectations which have led to this.
I think that's the way going forward OP. You can't deny dd2 her relationship but you don't have to go out of your way to fit in with their timetable preferences - try to engineer their access to dd2 for when it suits.
Id certainly minimise unsupervised contact with the cousins - I think the way they speak about dd1 needs keeping an eye on.

Because it’s a curtesy invite that’s all.

The same way you don’t invite a person and not their wife or husband to your wedding.

The child is basically forgotten about or when remembered not seen as family anyway. So maybe they are with their dad don’t need to worry about including them as they might not be here anyway.