Should I be wary of DD’s friend? or is it normal 11 year old behaviour?

[WorriedaboDD]

I could really do with some advice from parents who have been through this. Please some advice:

My daughter is 11, has just finished Year 6, and is about to start secondary school. There's one friendship in particular that's been on my mind. I'll call her friend Tina. They'll be going to the same secondary school and even be in the same form class, so I know they'll probably stay close.

The thing I'm struggling with is that Tina seems to tell her mum absolutely EVERYTHING, including things about my daughter. Everytime I bump into Tina's mum, she tells me something my daughter has apparently said or done that I knew nothing about! I always leave those conversations feeling a bit deflated and wondering why my daughter doesn't open up to me like that. I know every child is different, but I can't help feeling a little sad about it.

I also have this nagging worry that my daughter might be sharing private things about home with Tina, and then Tina is going home, telling her mum, and possibly gossiping about it to other people. Her mum has said a few things to me and asked me questions in a tone that suggests she knows things going on with myself and DH. I have told DD she shouldn’t share things going on at home with others.

The other thing is, I sometimes feel like Tina is a bit of a stirrer. My daughter has never, not once, come home gossiping or telling me things about Tina, yet Tina seems to go home and tell her mum every little thing my daughter has done or said. I don't know if she's just naturally chatty, if I'm being oversensitive, or if it's something I should be paying attention to.

I really don't want to be unfair or label an 11-year-old, and maybe this is completely normal at their age. I suppose I'm just wondering if anyone else has experienced this. Is this just how some children are, or would it make you a bit uneasy too? My DD seems very naive and innocent compared to this girl. It’s not even that she does t share with me but I feel in DD’s mind she doesn’t remember or deem it worthy of telling me things Tina has said or done.

I'd really appreciate any advice on how to approach this, especially with them starting secondary school. Would you just leave it alone and let them find their own way, or is there anything you would do differently?

Your daughter is 11, this is a vulnerable age for her, especially if you and your husband are arguing and sniping with each other, this will make her feel estremely insecure and unsafe. It's not surprising she is sharing her feelings with a trusted friend. Rather than be concened that she is sharing what you consider to be inappropriate with a friend, you need to address what is happening between you and your husband and create a safe space for your child to share her concerns with you rather than worrying about her friend sharing information with her mother that you're uncomfortable with - you need to think about why you feel that way.

I’d tell DD to be careful about what she tells Tina as Tina and her mum then chat and the mum reports back to you.

I’d share what the mum has said to you about DD fancying a boy or whatever and ask how she feels about the gossip.

Better for DD to know not share info with Tina in the future.

I can understand you feeling uncomfortable OP, but perhaps the place to start is by forgetting all this worrying about Tina and whether she is ND or overly chatty or whatever, and focusing in on your own DD.

I am not saying your DD has done anything wrong, but she is, after all the one who told Tina the information Tina is passing on.

I think I'd mention to your DD that Tina's mum has mentioned certain things to you and ask her if she spoke to Tina about it and if she'd like to talk to you instead. Reassure her you are happy to listen and hear her views and feelings. Maybe then she might get it off her chest in a home environment. I don't think you can very well forbid her to discuss things with her friend, but I do think much of the time children won't discuss these sorts of things with friends if they don't feel they need to. However it also isn't wrong to offer her a listening ear or to point out that certain things are private, It is a tricky line, because I think it is wrong to suggest to children they cannot reach out about something upsetting them, but equally children do need to learn to filter for privacy. My mum's friend had a type of lactose intolerance that meant she had really foul wind while it was getting sorted and her DD was making a comedy routine out of it at school, which was disloyal and humiliating. At your DD's age she needs to be slowly learning judgment as to what she really needs support with from her friend and what is just being lazily loose-lipped and betraying privacy, and you need to know where the issues fall for her on that spectrum too.

Yes, we cross posted and I agree.

This is an issue best dealt with in your relationship with your own DD rather than looking over the fence at Tina and her mum's relationship.

In that respect, the mum has done you a favour as you can alert DD to the fact the information is getting passed about.

It's not surprising she is sharing her feelings with a trusted friend.

The problem is the friend isn't all that trustworthy. She is treating the confidences as gossip,

Trust your instincts - you can ask the school to
put them in different classes, and encourage new friendships.
You can also talk to DD about your concerns, so she’s aware that things aren’t being said in confidence. She needs to explicitly ask Tina to keep some things private

I don't think I'd be encouraging this friendship with Tina. And I would say to your DD you do realise that everything you tell Tina is reported back to her Mum. I don't think this is a healthy friendship. Mum and daughter both sound pretty awful tbh.

I feel like others that the friendship matters and you need to try hard not to worry ...its normal to row, its normal for children to talk about their lives. I struggle to think what these "private things" might be..that your DD shouldn't share. I'd be frightened to change my daughter with dire warnings about friendship and the risks of that.

My mum isolated me from friends, family, healthcare providers etc so I could never tell people what was going on at home. @WorriedaboDD please don’t ask your daughter not to talk to her friends, it sounds like she could potentially be treading on eggshells at home, kids don’t routinely share stuff about their parents unless it’s something exciting or worrying, she needs to be able to offload.
perhaps the other mum is trying to check you’re ok rather than being a gossip?
if I were you I’d focus on keeping your little girl feeling safe and secure while you work out how to fix or end your currently toxic marriage.
it’s horrible for kids to live in a bad atmosphere were they have no control over the situation and no real understanding of adult dynamics

Calliopespa
She is a trusted friend to OP's daughter, she talks to her mother about what OPs daughter has said. That doesn't make her untrustworthy, that makes her an 11 year old who has a good relationship with her mother and maybe the information that's been shared by OPs daughter doesn;t make sense to her within her own family situation. OP said that friends mother asked if she was OK - given what little OP has said about the current relationsip between her and her husband, perhaps friends mother is concerned for OP rather than a gossip? Why is OP so concerned about sharing of information and trying to stop her daughter talking about home life and making daughter's frienfd the baddie - what is OP not addressing?

No, you really don’t have to tell your mother everything, unless it has to do with you directly or you’re concerned about someone else. One time my daughter told me about something very personal and embarrassing that her friend said happened to the friend’s younger brother, and I told her that her friend shouldn’t have been telling that to other people in the first place.

Also, I had a childhood friend who didn’t understand that “don’t keep secrets from grownups” was more about drug use and inappropriate touching than making a secret club at age ten and giving each other unicorn princess names. 🙄 “YankSplaining, I have to tell my parents our unicorn princess names! My parents say I shouldn’t keep secrets from them, and I shouldn’t listen to anyone who tells me I should!”

Not opining on whether Tina should have told her mother or not, but there are things kids really don’t have to tell their mothers, and even some things that they shouldn’t.

Telling people personal details about your family and private life especially when growing up is very common, but honestly never a good idea. The girls will not always be friends and sometimes children can be vindictive and use information against one another when they fall out or just to get points in a new friendship group.

I am just talking about normal life here, not abuse. People argue, sometimes the house is messy, you don't get your favourite food, you think mum is unfair, she yelled at you because your room was a tip - this stuff looms large and kids do have a way of exaggerating it so they can feel hard done by and get sympathy and bond more with their peers.

Have a gentle conversation with your daughter. Remind her that once information about your personal life is shared, that can't be undone. Ask her if she'd be good with someone sharing things she was talking about all over social media. If the honest answer is yes, no worries. If not she might at least learn to think before she offers herself up as gossip fodder.

There is nothing wrong with your daughter talking to a friend and friend talking to a mom. They're close. Tina is open with her mom where you're trying to shut down your daughter confiding about fighting in the home to a friend. With the home situation being bad, do not isolate her.

The mom could be letting you know she knows you and your husband are having so much rowing in the home your daughter is upset by it and seeing if you need support or help.

This is not a Tina problem. This is a problem for you and your family dynamic but you are blaming Tina instead

Has Tina ever been mean to your DD? If not I think she's just tells her Mum everything and maybe is just a bit rubbish at keeping secrets. Which TBF when it comes to safeguarding is actually really positive and I encourage my child not to keep secrets from me.

I understand you're upset about your marriage rows getting aired in public, but I think you need to have a proper reassuring talk with your daughter about them, maybe with your husband too. I imagine most children won't confront their parents about their arguing so shes using Tina as an outlet. You also need to have a proper sit down with DH and say any arguing and sniping cannot be in front of your daughter as she is obviously getting affected. Marriage counselling might be a good shout. Good luck OP.

I don't think Tina has actually done anything wrong here either. If shes ND then her mum does absolutley right to have a no secrets policy as ND children are very vulnerable. If the Mum is coming to you with what she's heard, she's either safeguarding and trying to gauge if you or DD are unsafe or maybe ND herself and lacks a filter.

I agree that the way to deal with this is to let your daughter know this information is being fed back to you by Tina’s mum. I had a similar friend who told her mum everything - once I got in trouble from my mother about one of the things, I quickly learned to distance myself from the friend and stopped sharing anything with her.

I think it would be a good idea to talk to your DD about how some friends might keep confidences and others may not. It's lovely she has a close friend. You don't have to give her details of what Tina's mum has said to you. I would also shut Tina's mum down if you think she's gossiping to you. Tell her you don't want to hear about your DD or any other little girls' secrets - make her understand that this is unbecoming behaviour for an adult.

I think there’s a difference between telling your mum you’ve started your period and what’s worrying you at school and discussing intimate conversations about private moments within somebody else’s home which affects not only them but other ppl. It is gossiping and it’s a horrible trait to encourage in a child IMO.

If the school is big enough, you can probably contact them and ask for your DD to be put in a different class from Tina.
This means that they can still see each other at break times but gives your DD the chance to make other friends.
I think I'd be wary of the gossip of the mum and Tina.
Slightly different but had an incident with my y6 DD where she chatted with someone she considered a good friend. She then made up a load of nasty stuff and told another mutual friend. My DD then had to deal with the fall out of all these lies about her. I had to deal with the mother of the lying girl. Fortunately all girls going to be in different schools but things can turn nasty if things aren't nipped in the bud!

Or maybe Tina is just an 11yo kid who is just trying to make sense of what OP’s DD is telling her by talking to her mum about it.

Absolutely well said @Unwelcomeknocking

I agree, but at 11 years old, you can't expect her to have that same level of comprehension. That's a conversation for her mum to have with her about boundaries, but only if her mum feels that it's an issue. This girl is obviously really comfortable with her mum, really transparent and quite the little gossip at the moment. She's going from primary school up to high school, so clearly still very young for her age. We're not talking about 17 year olds are we?

My daughter tells me everything (honestly I need a cast list sometimes 😂), but shes autistic and it's a way of processing. Her friends know she tells me everything and now they join in and also tell me all the events. But I never ever repeat anything unless it's a safety issue. (In fact when they're just waffling away I barely listen). I wouldn't say it's the friendship between the girls that's the issue, but Tina's mother not knowing when to keep it to herself. I think you have to accept you can't control what other people know or what they say and try to explain this to your daughter without being specific. A bit like explaining that when you put something online it's out there, it's the same if you tell people information. You lose control over it. Things like who fancies who just aren't important so I'd just let that go, but tbh as your daughter gets older you can't control what she decides to tell people about herself or her home-life, it will be a learning curve for her as it is for everyone.

This is a you problem.

firstly, come secondary school you’ll have nothing to do with the other parents.

telling your daughter not to discuss things that happen at home? Bad. Very very bad. Your child should feel able to discuss anything that she finds scary/sad/hurtful.

I may have missed it but all I can see so far is that you don’t think Tina is a good friend because she lacks adult discretion? Tina may be used to being in a very open family: her mom should be more discrete but as I say, you won’t have anything to do with her now anyway.

this is a you problem, and you need to evaluate how you tell your daughter to navigate life. Keeping secrets about damaging things is not the way to do it.

Like mother like daughter in terms of gossip and boundaries OP... It's one trait that I really dislike in others, ND or not. I'd be curious why this mum feels the need to share what she learned from her daughter with you, but it does not really matter. I'd also assume she's likely to do that with others too, and others may feel frustrated and upset the same way you do. I'd practice changing topics, asking about her daughter every time she tells me something about mine. It sounds like she has very little boundaries, with her daughter but also with others.

Once in new school, your daughter will meet a whole new group of peers and friendships often change at this stage. I'd encourage your daughter to spend time to get to know them.

I'd also remind your daughter that Tina shares everything with her mum. As they get older, this is likely to cause more friction.