The realisation my marriage is not going to be forever

[Mistymeg]

That’s it. I don’t see a lifetime of this. I also worry there is no smoking gun here. On paper he’s the perfect husband and Dad, gets up with the kids almost every morning, gets them ready for the nursery and drops them so I can get ready and commute, he also then goes into the office most days too, he dotes on them, he’s a good cook and does most of the cooking and bbqing, no controlling behaviour and keeps a lot of the house going really. I do my share, I definitely do, we have our roles and just like finances it’s pretty much 50/50, if anything I feel he’s a bit put out recently that my career is flying but he seems to cope better with the pressure of two toddlers, full time job and daily stress than I do, so everything has a cost.

That said, the spark has long gone. Way before the better jobs and recent pressures.

I’m so lonely. He barely looks at me or acknowledges me. I don’t look forward to being around him, the thought of dinner with him sounds dull to me and when he was due to be out last night and came home, I was disappointed.

Everyday I came home this week I asked how his day was, he’d answer and not ask me back. I made a point of it stating that he wasn’t making conversation back, and he claimed he had asked me but he hadn’t, I asked what I replied and he pulled from something else.

Tonight I switched tact and didn’t bother asking him how his day was. We had the usual transactional conversations about food and kids, admin, tv and pretty much sat in silence. It got to 9pm and I said it’s strange that despite me making a point of him not asking me about me day all week, tonight I didn’t ask him and he still hasn’t asked. As usual he gaslit me - it’s because I’d snapped at him earlier (apparently), then he said the amount of nights I’m on my phone… all my fault. Not that he could be better at that. I had a huge presentation at work this week and he didn’t wish me luck, message me in day or ask anything when he came home yesterday.

We have no spark, no sexual chemistry- I don’t enjoy sex with him, it’s just a tick box exercise to say we do it once a month but I’d say it’s more like 8 times a year. We do have two young kids and both work full time but honestly, we just WhatsApp back and forth mostly for communication. It’s all admin. I don’t enjoy time with him. He doesn’t like people who speak too much, doesn’t like stories, takes the mick out of people who tell boring stories. If I tell a story even if just about my day he zones out. Sometimes I will just open my mouth and he will huff before I’ve said anything.

I keep thinking when the kids are older it will get better but actually, I just don’t know if it will.

anyone else been here? We’ve been married 10 years and I’m not quite 40 yet so thinking it’s a long life ahead. That said I don’t want to share the kids, I don’t want to deal with the finance fall out, definitely don’t want to be dating again……. He is not open to marriage counselling but also comes from a strict catholic family so wouldn’t divorce either.

Even before we were married I noticed he wasn’t a team with me, even in front of his own family he’d be wanting to show off and the centre of attention and not think about me. He’s not like that generally but weirdly feels he has to impress his parents, they have a weird dynamic. He’s almost nervous in front of them…. It stretches further than that though, in group settings I had to tell him to stop making the butt of all his jokes. It might have been funny once or twice but everytime we went out he’d be bantering at my expense. It’s almost like if he wasn’t doing that he wouldn’t know how to interact with me in public. In general I’ve found he’s never had my back and will take the side of anyone or anything else. His response? You don’t need me to stick up for you, you’re strong enough.

honestly I wonder if an open relationship later down the line is an option. Something has to change.

When we are out with other parents I notice how affectionate they are subtly with one another, supportive and a team. It makes me think it’s not he ages of the kids. Has anyone been in a similar boat?

Initially I was going to say this is just marriage with young kids. We went through something similar (still are to an extent but it’s better than it was!) in that it just gets to the point of only talking about the kids/house/admin. We made a real effort to reconnect, put our phones down and try and have fun! It’s easier now the DC are older.

However, the jokes, the gaslighting, the indifference, I’m not sure you’ll get past that without outside help that he’s refusing to consider. He sounds quite unpleasant tbh and it won’t be long before your DC are old enough to hear it too. From what you’ve said YANBU to consider if this is all life has to offer and to plan your escape

I agree. Most men know it is socially unacceptable these days to be overtly nasty and abusive so there's a lot more subtlety now. Someone who treats you with disrespect is a no no.

Some of these comments seem really old fashioned. You don’t have to stay with him and be miserable just because you’re married. You can also divorce him, regardless of his religion.

This isn’t gaslighting. He’s not that nice but he isn’t gaslighting you.

I've been married over 35 years, and at one point we had 3 kids under the age of 5. That was really tough. Lots of mundane tasks.

My own childhood was pretty bad. This meant that I was often looking for validation. I really struggled with anything that seemed critical or demonstrating a lack of interest. The abandonment, alternating with punishment, I felt as a child has dogged me my whole life. I'm better at managing it now, though, after nearly 8 years in weekly f2f therapy. I've developed my own internal monologue which makes me less dependent on others and more resilient.

There have been periods in my marriage where we were just sort of rubbing along, getting through each day. And there have been other periods where I actively hated him - often because it felt as if he was living in his own little world and it had nothing to do with my world except for the kiddie crossover.

But at one point my husband did something amazing: he found a weekly babysitter and booked us on to a class - hippy meditation of all things. We would go for coffee and cake afterwards. For the first few months we really struggled to find things to say to each other. After 10 years, I didn't know who the man was sitting opposite me. However, it got better. I began to look forward to these 'date nights'. Slowly but surely we reconnected on a social level, away from the home and all those chores.

Fast forward another 10 years and we started going away together for little weekends, nothing grand, often just a nice hotel withing about 50 miles. A couple of nights to ourselves. Seeing each other outside the every day hurly burly of life helped. I'm a teacher and now we do it at the start of every summer holiday so I can reset and he can get his wife back.

To be honest, coming from a catholic background with no divorce in my family was kind of both the worst (my own parents) and the best for me because I've always known that, for me, 'til death do us part' is actually the contract and so we have to make it work, i.e. there isn't any 'out'. His family aren't catholics, all divorced, still going through versions of the same shit show with subsequent partners, etc. Everyone tells me that I got lucky. I don't think luck has anything to do with it.

I disagree. Someone being labelled needy isn't helpful.
At the least he's being disrespectful and downright rude by huffing when you start a story about your day. That's actually controlling as it's trying to stop you speaking and it seems to be working as you're affected by his behaviour.
It's normal to have the person you're closest to be interested in your day.
You need to have a serious conversation with him about how you feel. Doesn't matter if he doesn't believe in divorce. It's your life too. Make sure he understands that you either try to resolve these issues or what the consequences might be. This without putting it in such a way that it's serves as an ultimatum if you can. Ask him if their are issues for him in the marriage too.
I'd be lonely too. I'd stop having sex with him too not because you'd be using it as a form of punishment but why should you if you don't want to? No one should be having sex if they don't want to.
Loyalty is a big issue for me. You need to address this too.
You only get one life.

YANBU. You have also given him plenty of warning that he is not meeting your needs and all he can do is gaslight.

Take this slow, get advice ASAP and see how that feels. Plan a future and how you want it to look and then, as amicably as possible, tell him you are out the door.

YOLO.

Your marriage sounds very much like mine. My husband doesn’t show or talk about emotions whereas I am a very emotional person.
He is a good man. Good father. But can be moody dictated to by work.
He also shows love by actions and not words.
I have had counselling just for myself , he would never, and she said our ways of showing love are mismatched and neither are inherently wrong.
Currently I am choosing to stay, mostly for financial reasons. But I am also hopeful that once the kids are grown we will get back what we had.
I don’t think any relationship is perfect and there are ALOT of not good men out there. I look closely at my friends and colleagues relationships and while they seem happy on the surface they have problems underneath.

Like your husband mine would never praise me or say anything nice about me in public, that’s just not how he is.
I don’t know what the right thing to do is. I just wanted to share that you are not alone and I think this is quite common in many marriages

I was about to say just this.

Additionally I wonder what made you ignore the red flags before you got married? You say you were vulnerable and there was great sexual chemistry, but did you have serious doubts, as in “I really ought to run”…… but you didn’t - why?

Also, only sporadic sex….. who is driving this, you or him? In the rare instances when you do, why and how - what happens.

I think you should get counselling for yourself to help you clarify your thoughts. But if you end up feeling sure that there is no future, splitting sooner rather than later would be best. Because as others have pointed out, the fallout for the children is likely to be less devastating, but also for purely practical reasons. If your inheritance was fairly recent and you have kept it in your name only, you will lose less than if you wait or commingle it with family funds.

"I just wanted to be loved"

is probably the most dangerous thing in the world. It gets so many people into so much trouble. Listening to a romance scam podcast atm - this woman is ruined financially now - she just wanted to be loved too.

Not saying this is a romance scam but needing someone to love you and wanting it so badly is so fucking dangerous.

We need to teach our kids to not need this validation.

(sorry for deviation)

Can you remember a time when you did have feelings for him and enjoy each other's company? Did he ever have your back / show affection? I think these questions are important, if you do remember those times there's every chance you can get back there. If actually it's always been lacking but you got caught up in lust, the chase, the excitement, the rush for kids etc then that's a bigger problem.

I think we're similar. We had a period of being in the trenches and now the kids are older it's much easier to laugh together again and we also each have our own independence, go out with friends.

I think we're both quite similar though in that we both get exhausted and need time just chilling with the TV. We've been together so long we can just "be" together.

As for affection openly displayed, there are lots of different love languages. Physical affection is important but you can show up in a myriad of different ways, all of which are important

He sounds controlling, self centred and bad at managing his emotions. I would class making you the butt of his jokes as bullying.

You don’t have to hang in there hoping that maybe when the kids are older it will all get better. I wonder if you already know what you want to do but need support to do that? You have your whole live ahead of you - it doesn’t need to be miserable with a man who can’t / won’t cheer you on and celebrate who you are.

Very true.

I divorced my ex husband during the hard times. We get on really well now as friends. Young children, 2 careers is hard, it breaks many, others make it through those times.

I would do anything rash. You say you have two toddlers and work full time. A number of couple I know had awful storms at this stage and came back together after a few years. My husband and I are just rekindling having fun but by bit as our kids are now 2 and 4. We ended up going through counselling though as about 18 months ago I was confident I wanted a divorce. Try focussing on your own happiness, phone away in evenings, try to enjoy family life more and see if it helps.

I divorced regardless of religion.
I can't really say what I think of using religion as an excuse for not divorcing it would be deleted.
My 2nd h was similar to yours, little to no communication for the best part. I'd be in the same room, with him, no distractions on our own and would ask him a question. The response was always "Are you talking to me?" Not in a nasty way but genuinely wondering.
He didn't want a divorce, but quietly accepted his would be the first divorce in his family for 50 plus years. His family were very big on religion and I was going to hell apparently. Right... Okay if you say so.🙄

Claiming with certainty that a conversation happened in a completely different way to the reality is certainly an indication of gaslighting.

I have a few Catholic friends and priests can be quite tough during marriage preparation classes, not people you'd take the mick out of at all.

That said I don’t want to share the kids, I don’t want to deal with the finance fall out

I think you need to accept that there are no easy solutions here.

You can divorce him but it will not be painless. You will have to 'share' the kids, and there will be an impact on your finances. You may both be happier in the long term, but you can't just skip over the disruption and upset to get to the part where everything is settled.

Alternatively, you can stay and work on the relationship. This will also not be painless. It will involve some hard conversations, and it will take work. If he does eventually agree to counselling you may have to be prepared to hear some hard truths, as well as dishing them out. Things may get better in time and you might be glad you stuck it out, but there are no guarantees.

Nothing will change unless you change it.

@Mygardenshedisfallingdown His family were very big on religion and I was going to hell apparently.

Whaaat? For getting divorced ?
His family seem to have "got things really wrapped around their necks" when it comes to the Church's teachings.

op literally stated she's just needs to be loved, she seeks affirmation of a challenging work presentation and wants to be publicly praised like a child. all her actual words. so a bit needy in my view. doesn't mean Husband can't do better too

This has been my experience as well.
The Church would rather people backed out of a Catholic Wedding and had a Civil Ceremony, rather than go through with it and then end up in this situation later on.

He’s not into you, perhaps never was completely. Be sounds a bit narcissistic and I suspect he’s jealous of your career success and prefers to keep you in a little box so he can take the piss out of you.
it sounds very similar to my marriage and in the end he had an affair.
I think you’re flogging a dead horse and have to decide if you can deal with the fall out of the divorce v’s a lifetime with a man that doesn’t love or respect you.

Does he still show you love, OP? Does he still do things for you?
I remember talking to a friend a few years ago who was in a similar position to you. All our other friends advised her to stay in the marriage — they said it’s just what marriage is like; it’s hard when you’ve got young children; it’ll get better as they get older…
She ended up leaving the marriage and I know it was tough for a while (her DH — now exDH — was very bitter about it) but she’s much happier now.
I think only you can really know/decide whether your marriage is salvageable — but something that really stood out for me was you saying you were disappointed when your DH came home instead of staying out as planned. That’s quite telling, I think.