AIBU to feel uncomfortable about anti-English vibes from family?

[Notcominhomenow]

I'm English, my DH is Argentinian, and we have a 2-year-old DS.

I've always got on well with his family and we've visited them a few times or theyve come here. I speak the language fluently and am fairly integrated in that sense. DH has lived in the UK for 13 years and has always been very clear that he'd never move back to Argentina because of the economic situation there.

This week's football match was the first time England and Argentina have played each other since we've been together. I supported England (as I always would) and DH supported Argentina. Neither of us are particularly hardcore football fans, so we watched it without any issues like mature adults.

The wider family has been a different story though. My BIL and some of DH's cousins have been sharing anti-English posts on social media, "The Falklands are Argentinian" posts, and videos in the family WhatsApp group after the match showing people in DH's hometown chanting that the Falklands belong to Argentina and waving inflammatory flags. It's a very conservative small town.

I genuinely can't imagine my own family sharing any anti-Argentinian content or trying to inflame tensions like that if the situation were reversed.

I've never had particularly strong feelings about the Falklands issue or cared that much, but I can't help feeling there's just no need for thus politicisation of a sport. Most of the people posting are the younger members of the family, but they seem to have forgotten that both me and DS are English. It just feels unnecessary and, if I'm honest, a bit disrespectful. The older ones haven't said anything or have been more diplomatic.

It's also made me wonder about the future. Am I being unreasonable to worry that, as DS gets older, they might try to influence him with those kinds of views? I obviously expect him to know and appreciate both sides of his heritage, but I wouldn't be comfortable with anyone trying to push very political or nationalistic opinions onto him.

We were due to sort an Argentinian passport for DS (already has British and Italian) but now I don't feel that enthusiastic about the whole thing. Dh isn't bothered about the citizenship, it was mainly me who was driving it so he'd have more options when he's older.

Would this bother anyone else, or am I overthinking it? I just feel a bit shit and uncomfortable about the whole thing and that a stupid football match has brought out a very ugly side of people I considered family.

I don't really want to turn it into an issue as if these are personal posts meant for me, DH says its young family members being immature. I've muted everyone on social media for now for the foreseeable so I don't have to see anything else.

@pikkumyy77 What are you on about. The FI have had British settlers since 1700s. It has never been Argentinian, never, so what 40 years has got to do with it really is beyond me.

With respect you don’t know what you are talking about regarding The Falklands.

And you also seem not to realise Argentina was created due to colonialism too. The people there are the descendants of European migrants and European colonisers.

I think bringing up a half Argentinian child with the belief that they are "mixed race" because they are half Argentinian could be more confusing to them when they visit Argentina/hang out with Argentinians and find out that in fact no-one in their Argentinian side of the family sees them as that. Particularly if they are blonde. Its like insisting Elon Musk a children must be mixed race because he comes from South Africa. Plus, the OP is raising her children with her husband who presumably does understand the culture etc.

It’s not about perspective. It’s a matter or historical fact.

This is a very US perspective. There are plenty of Latin Americans who are ethically completely white and recent descendants of Europeans.

Ds is being brought up bilingual with biannual trips to Argentina and plenty of cultural references around the home etc. We also have local friends of a similar background.

But I'm not going to tell him he's mixed race when he's not. On forms I put him as 'White European' or 'white other'. Makes no sense to put Latin American when there is no indigenous ancestry in the family.

Exactly. Argentinian is not a race. Most of them are Italian, Spanish or German.

I've chilled out about it a bit more now. I think emotions were high after the match plus I had terrible PMS 😂

If you’re DH doesn’t like the English then he should certainly go back to his own country then.

Never mentioned a single thing about DH not liking the English. His wife and son are English ffs. Please learn to read a thread properly before commenting

Yes it is, and sorry, I meant defend, not invade, as clearly Argentina had invaded, not the UK. Think the OP wants to keep things off the Falklands though. Don't blame her!

Yes, I see this a lot amongst the trendy middle class. Everyone is encouraged to celebrate their culture except England. Really toxic mindset.

While, by and large, I agree with you – Argentina's claim to the Falklands isn't baseless, and it's just based on proximity. Argentina were supposed to inherited Spain's territories when they were liberated – the Falklands. They also had a (yes contested, brief and tenuous) authority over the islands before the British in 1820-30s.

Overall, I believe in the free and independent vote of the current islanders, but still – it's not all clear cut.

To pedantic 1820s to 1830s is not “before the British”.

Hence me clearly saying it's contested, brief and tenuous. Though Britain did not renounce sovereignty in 1774, they did withdraw, and Spain was in effective and long-term control of the islands. Argentina did establish a settlement before the British returned. The UN class the FI as a disputed territory.

But that’s not before the British. The British were the first to lay claim to and inhabit the Falklands.

Even you note “before the British returned”.

Urgh – again, I say contested, brief and tenuous.

If British claim was uncontested, then it wouldn't be in disputed today by the UN – it is. The islands were claimed, settled, abandoned, and reoccupied by several European powers during the 18th century: France established the first permanent settlement in 1764, Britain established another settlement in 1765, Spain objected and expelled the British in 1770, then allowed them to return, Britain withdrew four years later and Spain settled again and withdrew in 1811.

The historical record is unusually messy and because international law doesn't contain a single rule that automatically resolves disputes like this.

I am not talking about the contested. I am talking about your comment that the brief period of contested ownership by Argentina was “before the British”.

It wasn’t.

Yes and by your own admission it was rather pedantic – so it's getting a bit much now.

🙄 Ok.

It’s a pendantic point but an important one. Alleging the Falkland was actually an Argentine posession before Britain would paint Argentina’s decision to invade and occupy the Falklands in a very different light.

@Notcominhomenow Yes, it seems that many people don't realize this. One of DD's best friends is Peruvian and her family is 100% ethnically Italian on both sides - their ancestors emigrated only a few generations ago so completely traceable.

I believe that Messi is ethnically European too. As you said upthread, modern Argentina is a young country, I'd even compare it to the US in terms of mass immigration. It's fascinating really.

If if was that important it wouldn't be disputed, and it is.

@Didimum Yes, it's messy. It seems most democratic to follow the wishes of the islanders themselves - if Argentina called for another referendum, that would be fair enough.

The idea of giving the islands to a country that they don't wish to be a part of leaves a sour taste. It's like giving Trump Greenland when the residents absolutely don't want to be controlled by the US!

I think many people just assume Colonialism is just a British thing and all South / Latin Americans are indigenous native Americans. The fact Spanish and Portuguese are the two main languages on the continent is just random coincidence. They’re pretty much all settler states.

You do know that British settlers lived on the Falkland Islands before Argentina was even a country right?
I visited the FI a few years ago during one of my husbands tours there in the RAF.
The lovely people are generally British and held a referendum to stay so.
Nothing to do with Argentina.
They claim they are, they invaded and got their ass kicked.
Politics should not be brought into sport.
But expect nothing less from a country like Argentina.
Come on 🇪🇸

It is important. Facts are important. The dispute is over whose territory the Falklands are now. What is not disputed is historical fact. And historical fact is that Britain established a settlement on the Falklands before Argentina existed. The 1700s happened before the 1800. That’s not contestable.
To say Argentina was there “before the British” is factually inaccurate.

If they had been Argentina’s invasion would be a totally different thing. More in common with Britain’s seizure of Hong Kong or the various colonies throughout Africa.