To think it’s turning into genocide in real time

[Everythingnotsavedwillbelost73]

Just seen this on the news- how can this be right? It genuinely is starting to feel like genocide.

What Hamas did was beyond appalling. But this is also beyond appalling too. Its trying to wipe Gaza off the map. Over 500 kids have already died. Human rights watch have verified that Israel uses white phosphorus against Gaza, which is a war crime.

And everyone is just watching it happen.

“The Israeli army has just ordered the entire civilian population of Gaza to evacuate south within 24 hours. The UN says that amounts to 1.1 million people& applies to 100s of 1000s sheltered in UN buildings & their staff. This is impossible without “devastating human consequences”
Leaving aside the international law implications, I cannot emphasise enough how impossible this kind of movement of people would be. I have spent a lot of time in Gaza it is one of the most densely populated places on earth, there are pretty much only 2 roads south - along the coast and down the centre - they aren’t wide or well paved. I spoke to the gaza health ministry yesterday who said every hospital was overflowing. How would the wounded and elderly be transported? There is a massive fuel shortage how would vehicles drive? There would be no where for 1.1 million to go even if they got there. Rafah crossing to Egypt is not operational because of Israeli airstrikes.”

This is how Genocide is classified;
U.N. Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide:

"In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

• Killing members of the group;

• Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

• Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part"

The actions of both Israel & Hamas fit this description too. It’s just fucking beyond terrible. And it feels like some world leaders are just cheering from the sidelines 😪

I’ve been to enough weddings where I didn’t know any of the couple.

And?

@Toothyfruity

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat
They also seem to have evidence it wasn’t them last night.

I've seen propaganda. No evidence yet.

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Because of your entrenched convictions there isn't any evidence that you won't dismiss as propaganda and you will never change your views

@Efacsen

Oh it’s alright, apparently all the women and children deserve that faecal water because Hamas are evil terrorists who bomb their own people anyway.

So cutting off their water and food is nothing to worry about. If Hamas bomb them and kill them, it’s fine for Israel to do the same and treat them as ‘human animals’ killing them slowly and agonisingly.

@ChardonnaysBeastlyCat

Really? Okay. You’re embarrassing yourself

I think you are embarrassing yourself when you reach for things like who was a wedding or not.

@ChardonnaysBeastlyCat

Except I didn’t. But you tying yourself in knots to prove that the president attending a wedding is likely to have been unknown to the bride and groom and probably ‘just a plus one’ is just silly.

Oh FFS.

Ok so I'll repeat what I've said on previous threads.

I don't agree with Israel turning off the water. It's not what I would've done. I think Israel does have a right to defend itself against Hamas but they should've gone about it in a different way.

So now that I've acknowledged I don't think Israel has done the right thing, can any of you anti-Israel posters please just acknowledge that Hamas and their friends have so far killed as many people these past couple of weeks as Israel has? Israelis and Palestinians included.

Or will you keep maintaing that the hospital was bombed by Israel despite the evidence to the contrary? Because that suits your narrative.

@Clavinova

"Presumably Palestinian Islamic Jihad are not the same group of terrorists as Hamas though?"

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They are absolutely not the same, PIJ is a more extreme version of Hamas and until this conflict was seen as a rival to Hamas. Indeed on recent polls, the PIJ is much more popular in Gaza than Hamas is.

Separately the PIJ is linked to the Muslim Brotherhood and the attacks against Egypt in Northern Sinai.

www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/polls-show-majority-gazans-were-against-breaking-ceasefire-hamas-and-hezbollah

@Toothyfruity

"No, I just know that Israel has previously lied about murdering civilians so I won't trust their propaganda on this one."

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This is my point your entrenched conviction is based on "I just know that Israel has previously lied" or that any information coming from Israel is untrustworthy propaganda.

Out of interest if there was evidence from Hamas or PIJ would trust that? Or if the evidence was from the US or UK would you trust that?

Who can we trust.
The UN

@1dayatatime

The irony here is that I’ve seen you on multiple threads defending Israel no matter what they do but the entrenched belief that Israel are blameless is yours. You have been relentless

Why would you trust the UN?

'Over the past five decades, the United States has vetoed at least 53 UN Security Council resolutions critical of Israel.'

A history of the US blocking UN resolutions against Israel | Israel-Palestine conflict News | Al Jazeera

China, Kuwait and Indonesia are on the UN Human Rights Council.

45 Islamic countries have signed the Cairo Declaration of Human Rights in Islam.

Cairo Declaration on Human Rights in Islam - Wikipedia

The UN is not a serious organization. How could it possibly be given the state of its constituent members, no matter which side of the debate you're on?

Biden speaking in Tel Aviv now “The US unequivocally stands for the protection of civilian life during conflict,” he said. He says he has asked the Israeli cabinet to agree to the delivery of aid in Gaza, with inspections that will prevent it reaching Hamas.

He goes onto to talk about various aid packages for Israel and Palestinian people which the USA will provide

Is this any kind of commitment to doing something SOON about the humanitarian crisis in Gaza?

A US veto led to the UN security council failing to agree to any resolution on the Middle East crisis after the US rejected a Brazil sponsored proposal that called for humanitarian corridors, a pause in the fighting and a rescinding of the order

The US ambassador said she was horrified and saddened by the loss of life, but added Hamas actions that had brought about the humanitarian crisis. She also called for time to let Biden’s diplomacy play out.

Israel thanked the US for using its veto.by Israel requiring citizens in Gaza to leave the North of Gaza.

Well this a bit of a shit outcome

I bet it’s US missiles that are being used in the attacks on Gaza 🙄

@Green777

"You have been relentless"

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Firstly thank you, I try to do my best in relentlessly pointing out deliberate misinformation whenever I see it backed by factual evidence with links.

Some of my work includes :
Pointing out that the use of white phosphorus in 155mm M825 smoke screen artillery is a legitimate military use and not a war crime.
That cutting off power to Gaza for the purpose of degrading Hamas military capability is not a war crime even if this results in civilian hardship.

Opinions based on conviction rather than facts and evidence simply harden opinions and make any peaceful solution to this crisis even harder to reach.

Of course if I have posted anything that is factually incorrect then I would absolutely welcome counter factual evidence.

So the US is now of the opinion that it was a misfired missile from Palestinian Islamic Jihad:

The US has an independent assessment that it was a Palestinian Islamic Jihad group rocket that misfired and hit the hospital in Gaza, two senior officials have told our US partner network NBC

The counter argument to this is of course is that the US as an ally of Israel would say this.

Yes it is

and this is what many people have wanted for a long time

I'm finding the protests astonishing!

Are they happy to protest against hammas or is it a case that it doesn't matter if hammas slaughtered their own?? Where is the outrage about that.

The US will absolutely support Israel

there is an election next year

The west will always support Israel and nothing will ever change that

Some bizarre reasoning up thread.

The UN have condemned Israel many times!

Therefore, the UN can't be trusted.

@PaxOmnibus

"Who can we trust.
The UN"

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And where exactly does the UN get satellite imagery and radar data from other than the US or Israel?

Incidentally Israel is to present hospital explosion evidence to UN Security Council today to argue that the missile had nothing to do with them.

The counter argument will of course be that they would say this wouldn't they.

The most likely conclusion from the UN will be that it is not possible to definitively say who is responsible for the explosion at the hospital but that it condemns all attacks on civilian and hospitals.

Guessing it will be extremely difficult to prove who did it with each blaming the other.

There needs to be some completely unbiased independent reporting on the situation.