Well, it’s happened... the trans activists have waded into the 8th amendment issue in Ireland

[AngeloMysterioso]

And are apparently pushing for the language in the repeal legislation to be “gender neutral”.

Quote from the article-

“Despite what some may believe, men can become pregnant too. There are tens of thousands of transgender men and non-binary people in Ireland who can conceive, and when speaking about reproductive healthcare, we must always be mindful of that.

“It’s imperative that newly written legislation uses inclusive language. By including this, trans men and non binary people will not hit legal barriers should they need to receive an abortion. By using the term pregnant people in new legislation, as well as protecting women, we are also protecting and respecting all gender identities should a crisis pregnancy occur.”

So. That’s nice. Thousands upon thousands of women have suffered, many have died, because of bullshit like the 8th amendment. And after fighting so hard for so fucking long and finally winning the right to bodily autonomy and reproductive rights, if the TAs get their way, we get to be referred to as pregnant people

I’m a bit of a TERF at the best of times but this is beyond fucking insulting. Savita Halappanavar wasn’t a pregnant person. Michelle Harte wasn’t a pregnant person. Sheila Hodges wasn’t a pregnant person.

If the TDs capitulate and let this happen I will be really pissed off.

I hope the Transmen start pushing into Male only spaces.
They pass much better so they probably already do use men's spaces.
Something to do with testosterone as I understand.
The man Friday group were trying to make the point that self id means no changes have to be made in appearance to Id as the opposite gender.
As that's the whole point of SELF id

I hope the Transmen start pushing into Male only spaces

Yep. Like demanding entry to study at Catholic seminaries and visiting Mt Athos.

That reminds me - are there any trans Catholic priests?

TRAs are running a shrewd campaign, in which they lobby various organisations to allow TIMs into women's spaces. Their modus operandi is that if they succeed with just some of them, the momentum of this will encourage others and make the acceptance of self-id in parliament more likely.

YY.

Why is this even an issue? The right for an abortion has been won, and if the law says 'people' rather than 'women' then it reduces the chance for court cases later on? IMO it makes absolute sense for the wording to be gender neutral! And I fail to see how this is insulting? Everyone who gets pregnant identifies as a person. Not everyone who gets pregnant identifies as a women. So be inclusive! Or I guarantee in a few years they'll be some poor person who isn't able to get an abortion off some conservative prick because they identify as male! Am I completely missing the point? Seriously don't get why people are making such a massive fuss about disagreeing?!

Am I completely missing the point?

Yes. I used to think like this until I thought about it and became aware of what's going on.

Ask yourself this: are you happy for there to be no word that means biological women?

And for the word mother to be meaningless? Offensive even. Think about what that means? We all came from a mother. Mothers were worshiped in ancient times. Now, we're being told we don't exist? That's just twisted.

Are you happy to be told you shouldn't talk about abortion, or periods, or pregnancy, or your genitals on social media, in public spaces or in the company of men-who-identify-as-women and their supporters as it's offensive, as you're exercising your cis-priviedge?

Would you be happy for your elderly female relatives to have their intimate care in an old people's home performed by a person with a penis, after they'd requested women only?

Would you be happy to request a female HCP for your smear and get a nurse with stubble and a penis?

Are you happy for women to have no right to assemble without male bodied people to say they want to be there?

Are you happy for lesbians who say they are only attracted to women-born-women to be called bigots and to lose access to support through LGBT organisations and groups because they have become hostile to lesbians?

Are you happy for your teenage daughters to have to shower with people with penises in communal showers and to be told they're bigots if they complain?

This is all part of the same thing. There is a concerted campaign afoot, of which this is a part - to erase the word women as a meaningful category and to give people born as men the right to women's spaces. It's about rolling back the rights we've gained as women the last 100 years or so.

The inclusive thing to do would be to make a extra leaflet / web page / etc for trans people which uses the terms pregnant person, and to make sure their care is catered for. But NOT to make the terms that are used by everyone, ones that erase women.
That's not inclusive. That's denying the biological reality of women.

@Sleepless123456789 is this OK with you? If not, why not?

Or how about this one?

Or perhaps you'd be OK with this? If not, can you articulate why?

Oh for gods sake !

Savita Halappanavar wasn’t a pregnant person.

That's a bit insulting. She clearly was. Are you saying she wasn't pregnant or not a person?

Or DailyMailWankersNet

busybarbara she was a pregnant woman. Woman is not a dirty word.

How utterly ridiculous and pathetic. Only the female sex can get pregnant. What you decide to do with your body afterwards is your concern, but if you were born a woman then and only then can you get pregnant. Bloody awful how people feel they can take this issue for their own.

When I was pregnant, I was a pregnant woman, unless stated otherwise! Only women or Females can be pregnant.

My first deletion!

My first deletion!

Pretty much how it feels to be a woman right now

The tail is wagging the dog.

@JacquesHammer Indeed.

@sleepingdragons ! awful, joyless, your examples show how ludicrous this language is. Gestators Men are never reduced to this. Impregnators = men. We will never see men reduced to that in a legal document.

off some conservative prick

If there’s a prick involved I can guarantee they will get anything they want...

yy to Salvita being a woman. She died due to the fact that a MOTHER"S life was only equal to the foetus's life and they didn't intervene in time. The amendment that was the cause of her death didn't say that a person's life was equal to a foetus, it said mother, so it was her biology, her being a woman that cost her her life as a woman in Ireland.

Seriously don't get why people are making such a massive fuss about disagreeing?!

Perhaps RTFT then?

It was suggesting that that got me censored, Ereshkigal!