DD behaved abysmally and need to vent

[Innish22]

My DB looked after both of my DCs at the weekend and DD (11) and himself had a falling out. DB was furious when dropping them back and said outright that he won’t be looking after her again.
I don’t blame him and I’m very disappointed in her, but I also know that my brother holds grudges for ever, which means that this will cause friction for the wider family.
DD is digging in her heels and refuses to apologise, but she seemed upset this evening and I think that she is ashamed and will come around.
That’s it. I just needed to vent because it’s the last thing I needed to start the week.

Of course if it isn’t true, DD shouldn’t be throwing words like that around. But the problem is the reaction of anger and punishment has happened before any calm conversation. So if it was true you’d never know now. And you might never be told if someone else does what she’s accused the uncle of (demonstrating unhealthy interest in children) because of the, frankly OTT reaction based on assumed other people believing her which is demonstrably not the case is it? People have been calling her a nasty bitch. So, my point was simply - ask questions calmly, get the to actual root of the problem and then discuss with DD why it’s important to tell the truth about this stuff, how it would impact genuine victims and innocent grown ups, how it will help real perpetrators to hide because of the boy who cried wolf etc.

This thread is alarmingly dismissive and the vitriol directed at the child (who we don’t know any better than we know the uncle) is disturbing.

But all of this is moot. Op said quite clearly she spoke to DD after her brother told her what had happened and DD admitted she made the remark because she was angry at having her iPad taken away. So the root of the problem has already been established - and OP says it’s been a bone of contention for a long time regarding DD’s behaviour. Probing beyond that is suggestive of something else entirely. It isn’t just DD who needs protection here.

I wouldn't let a male friend watch my children. My father and brother do not fall in that category.

She didn’t say she had spoken calmly to her DD. Her uncle was already furious - that would be enough for a retraction. Then the OP said she had already confiscated her DDs phone and not spoken to her about it properly.

Look, in all likelihood, the DD said something without fully understanding the damage it could do and she needs talking to. But I am shocked by how many people leapt to that conclusion immediately based on ‘she later “admitted” it wasn’t true’ - do you have any idea how common this is in genuine victims of abuse? It’s such a dangerous thing to dismiss, and yes, more so than the danger to him - which it seems is all but imaginary.

And maybe I will ‘bother’ explaining to you again that DD didn’t ‘disclose’ anything to anyone. She had an argument with her uncle because he took away her iPad when her screen time was up - something OP says has long been an issue where her behaviour is concerned. It was DB himself who brought it up to OP - because of the language DD used. I wholeheartedly agree with everything you say here, but the facts as OP has presented them, don’t support any wrong doing on DB’s part.

You seem to have missed the part about how disclosures actually look in real life and that what you’re dismissing (an offhand comment) could be how she’s trying to start a conversation. I can’t be bothered to talk to you about this anymore since you don’t seem interested in anything other than the version you have already decided on.

It is quite common for young people to call people pedophiles as an insult lately which is an awful trend. My son said some very uncool things about someone once, to me but with another person present that presented the someone else in a very bad light. We watched the NZ film "Hunt for the Wilderpeople" where the kid in the film says some things that lead hikers to believe that the Sam Neil character is a pedophile and they turned on him. I sat down with my son and explained how it is really serious, those people want to hurt him, they want to take him away, he could go to jail...". I discussed how it is important to tell if you are concerned about someone or something but there is also a very serious responsibility to not mislead people. It really helped to discuss it externally so I was able to share my opinion without my son being defensive. I'm not sure if this is something you would consider, or if there are some more recent media examples to use. My son at this age was very clueless about the implications of such an accusation because he is a generally bit clueless and his mouth was bigger than his brain.

Deleting and rewriting what i just wrote.

What a horrific thing to say, and where did she get that attitude and mentality from?

I had originally written about my niece and nephew who can be bratty, but that I always forgive them and laugh/move past it, but we're talking things like my niece forgetting to say please and thank you.

God, when I was 11, all I knew about was Curiosity Killed The Cat and Bros.

Wow, the brother is completely right to refuse to ever mind her again, it's just not worth the risk to him to do so. I would advise him to keep his distance and certainly never be alone with her again. With the way you've minimised this if I were him I'd probably go no contact with you also. It sounds like you've all got used to taking advantage of his good nature and she has no respect for anyone at all.

What a shame for you and your daughter and your other child but I suspect you will both only learn from this if your brother is in charge of setting consequences for it as you seem so powerless and reluctant to do so in any meaningful way.

Your first step should be to get rid of the ipad altogether and start taking an interest in raising your children yourself.

It’s baffling that people on this thread have ignored all the things stated by OP and somehow tried to twist it into the DD being right. MN all over right there.

She didn’t tell her mother, she said it just to her uncle.

And if she acted out of spite then your post proves why you don’t ever call anyone that ever - someone will always assume there is something nefarious going on.

What is to stop her from saying to someone that she called her uncle a paedo, and therefore causing the rumour mill to go into overdrive?

And again,assuming she was being spiteful, at 11 she’s old enough to understand the implications of that and also should understand what crying wolf means.

I think he needs to avoid the DD and her sibling going forward - they don’t get to have a ‘fun uncle’ if one of them behaves like that.

Its less harmful to use pretty much any other insult.

Does she really understand what that is ?

It doesn't really matter but I expect she does, she's been raised by an ipad, God only knows what she's seen.

She’s 11. Of course she does. She was clearly angry that her iPad had been taken away so she went for the most vile insult she could think of.

If she had called him a cunt it wouldn’t even have been as bad

You’re handling this really well with sensitivity x

11 years old and understands that means she’s accusing her uncle of grooming and raping little boys ? Blimey they grow up fast round your way.

She may have a sense of what it means but I doubt she understands the full implications.

It’s not that deep, she will undesgand she was insinuating he was attracted to small boys, many eleven year olds would understand this,

I dont think angry denands for apologies are the right way to go.
I think I'd start with a conversation about what being a pedophile actually means, how very serious and awful it is, and ask her if she thinks her uncle deserved to be called that.
Assuming she says no, them I'd try to encourage her to imagine how very hurtful it would have been for him, and how very dangerous it would be for him if people thought it was true, and try to get her to see why he's so upset and angry.
Hopefully this will be followed by genuine remorse and a genuine desire to make amnends.
If so, I'd then encourage her to write a note to him with the apology.

Given that most of the arguments seem to have been about time limits imposed on the use of the iPad how do you figure that ‘she’s been raised by an iPad’ ? She’s eleven. iPad use will be the norm at school and it sounds as though there are strict limits on the use at home.

Yes but the difference between what she understands and thinks she’s said and what the brother will feel she’s insinuating is vast.

Firm agree.

Agree. Seems to be the trend on MN these days - ignore or cast doubt on what the OP actually posts and just go with your own agenda. I think this whole thread is a prime example of the potential consequences of this child repeating what she said to others.

She's clearly addicted to it and now that addiction is manifesting itself in her terrible behaviour. How do you think that happened?

But that doesn’t lessen the impact of the words themselves. If, as OP implies in an update, she used the words ‘you like little boys’ that implies a certain level of understanding, and that in itself is deeply hurtful - as it was meant to be.

Not on OP’s watch if there are limits applied and policed - which is clearly the case from what OP has said.