DS has been suspended from work

[APandafromRwanda]

DS is 19 and has been in a retail job (a big chain) for about 8 months. He left college and didn't want to go to University so found himself a job in this shop

He called me yesterday asking if I could pick him up early (a few hours before his shift was due to finish). When he got in the car he then proceeded to tell me he's been suspended by management

The incident was that he was talking with two other members of staff. There was some banter about a third colleague (I will refer to them as Tom) who wasn't present. Ds then implied (he says he did not explicitly say this, or use the "p" word at any point) that Tom had indecent images on his phone. It was a joke

One of the present colleagues then went to management and reported him. The other colleague who was there has backed the first one up and given a statement saying the same thing. That Ds called Tom a "P doe file".

If he gets sacked (very likely at the moment) is he going to have to tell his next employer about why he was sacked or will it be mentioned on a reference?

Not a surprising outcome, particularly in light of the previous warnings.

It is concerning that he still doesn't think he did anything wrongbut hopefully this will be a learning experience for him.

Let him experience what it's like to have no money for a while and perhaps he will start thinking about it differently.

He needs to resign. Don't see this as a big deal breaker. He is learning actions have real consequences and that you don't get millions of chances as an adult, like you do at school.

As the poster above me says, unsurprising given the previous warnings (and interesting that he had chosen not to mention these to you). If I were trying to give him the benefit of the doubt I'd wonder whether he does feel a little ashamed and is putting on the bravado. Or maybe he literally has no insight or ability to reflect on his own behaviour in this situation. I think my biggest thing as a parent would be making sure that he doesn't assume you are going to step in and fund all the things his wages were funding...

I am sorry I didn't see the update. Don't subsidise him more than you need to for him to eat. He has to sign on, no extra money for going out. He needs to learn not to do this again, even if he thinks it was fine.

@APandafromRwanda
Tell him about my dad. He was an engineer in the oil industry, high up. Earning between £300k and £500k on the jobs he did. And this was back when it was an old boys club.

He was working in Glasgow, told a rangers/celtic joke and he was fired for it. A guy earning hundreds of thousands, with his pick of jobs to walk into, high up on the project, in the oil industry full of men… and he got fired for a football joke.

Your son needs to accept and understand that this happens at all levels, in all sorts of jobs and it doesn’t matter what he thinks personally… he needs to keep his mouth shut when at work.

He won't think he's fine and blame other people forever, I promise you. It's all part of the process of maturing. He's in temporary denial because he has been rejected for his unacceptable behaviour and he's still too immature and proud to truly understand why or accept it being the result of his own actions.

Oh dear this update is bad news. DS got asked not to come back to a job after a stupid incident, but he recognised the seriousness of what he did almost immediately and sent genuine apology messages to those concerned and was contrite with us about what he had done. Yes sounds like it could have been an overreaction from his employers, but he shouldn’t have been making those remarks in the first place.

I would change the wifi password in the evenings, wake DS up every morning at 8 and expect him to be applying for jobs daily.

As long as you don't tell him it's not his fault and don't give him money to enjoy himself, he will be fine. He needs to learn actions have consequences. You don't need to hammer this home. Just tell him he needs to sign on. He will get sanctioned so will have reduced money for a while. Feed him and house him, but nothing else. Tell him he has to apply for jobs if he wants money. Don't let him not sign on.

Lots of people muck up at this age. If he talks to you about being sacked just reiterate it doesn't matter if he thinks it was okay to say, you have to be careful what you say at work.

He has to sign on
So taxpayers have to fund a healthy adult because he can't behave in the workplace?

Yes sounds like it could have been an overreaction from his employers,
This is his third offence! OP said he's had at least two previous warnings.

On what planet was this an over reaction. Do you work, you want to be called a paedo to your colleagues? And it was his third time.

Has he acknowledged he was in the wrong?

My, you sound lovely…

I know this is all finished now but I just read this and wanted to say your definition of "banter" is ridiculous.

It's only "banter" when it’s give and take joshing between two people. In this case the person who was the target wasn’t even present.

Oh dear.
and sympathy for you @APandafromRwanda

I hope you have the strength now for the tough love your DS needs. His immaturity and idiocy has rendered him temporarily unemployable and he will feel the impact of it for decades if he is allowed a nice comfortable effort-free existence at home with all the food and wifi and electronic devices he needs so no reason to try and do anything to make himself employable. His only hope will be if you don't provide that comfortable trap.

Yes, I am lovely because I would not have reported a young lad at work for this, especially if I thought it was going to lose him his job. The comment should just have stopped there and one of the 2 people (or both) could have had a word with him that he cannot speak like that at work.

What would you have done?

@WildGarlicSoup
The op said in a later post that it was at least the 3rd time he had been reported, this was not the first incident.
I have since found out (from him) there were at least two other incidents at work where he was given a warning about his actions/conduct and attitude. He didn't previously tell me about either of these

Fair enough, I did miss that. But I still wouldn't have told on him. I am an adult and perfectly capable of telling a 19 year old when the words they use are not acceptable at work.

How much leeway would you give an employee then? Would you let them repeatedly say that another employee (possibly also a 19 year old) has images of child sexual abuse on his phone?

one of the 2 people (or both) could have had a word with him that he cannot speak like that at work.

He had already been warned at least twice about his conduct at work. There may have been other incidents before it got to that point. Perhaps his co-workers were just fed up with him.

What would you have done?

I'd have had a word with the worker and asked them to rein it in. Often there would be some kind of policy to link to - for example, the banter might not be the major problem, but the time and place - perhaps it would be if it were done very publicly. Ever heard 2 supermarket workers bitching about other colleagues, or 2 guys rating a woman whose image is on the phone or who's no longer present? It's not a good look.

That's exactly what the manager had done 2 or 3 times previously.

Perhaps. Or perhaps not. I have no idea.

All I know is that most decent adults would TELL a 19 year old themselves be careful what they say at work.

Only immature, weird people go running straight to the boss.

I wasn't asking you, but there are a lot of 'perhaps' there!

I have just read the update from the OP @APandafromRwanda I am sorry but hope you son has found another job.

So, yes, OP said in her last update that there were other things that happened for him to lose his job.

I would still not report a 19 year old to management, and would have a word with them myself.

I would hate to feel responsible for someone losing their job and if that makes me 'lovely' then I'm very glad to be that way. Some posters really need to think about their own children being in this scenario - find some compassion and common sense (which isn't very common on MN!).

@WildGarlicSoup
What would you think if you were the parent of the person who was being spoken about in this way? If your son came to you and said that a colleague was telling other colleagues that he had images of child sexual abuse on his phone? Would you be so tolerant then?

And some posters (well, you) need to look up the definition of the word "banter" and realise that it is completely inapplicable to what we are told happened here.

And what about imagining your own child being the victim in this scenario, with another worker, someone already warned at least twice about their behaviour, spreading vile, untrue gossip about them?