Do you feel that gender identity exists and is innate?

[FairHippopotama]

In progressive circles, there's the concept of 'gender identity' where everyone has a gender (not necessarily corresponding to their sex) that is unchangeable and inherent to them as a person. Do you agree with this? Why or why not?

I don't have a gender identity in that sense. I'm aware of my sex of course, and I'm aware of how society reacts to my sex, but the sexist gendered roles and expectations that are imposed on me don't form any part of my personal sense of who I am.

Do you think personality is the same as an identity? I tend to see them as different things

And those of us who are from the pre social media era were still sexually discriminated against because we are women - that’s due to our sex not gender.

Many of us on these boards grew up fighting against sexism and pushing for equality. Again it’s about our sex nothing to do with gender stereotypes. Regardless of how we present, we are women.

This gender nonsense harms women because men claim to have a female gender identity - which is complete bollocks - and women are bullied into moving aside and having out boundaries eroded in the name of #bekind. Yet society doesn’t ask the same of men

Society treats people in certain ways as a result of their sex.

So how can someone decide to have an opposite sex 'gender identity', or a nonbinary gender identity which says they have no sex at all?

It's nonsense, particularly when you realise that some people claim that there are 60+ genders.

No. And no.

Yes to gender identity, sort of. We all have a relationship to 'gender' - how we feel about conforming to the stereotypes associated with our sex. So, whether we want to conform or react against stereotypes or don't even care much.

I think its pathologising and daft to set much store by it as a 'thing', though. It seems about as deep as a teenage multiple choice quiz on enneagrams.

No, its not innate. It's affected by many things and changes all the time.

I don't disagree with that but I wouldn't describe it as a gender identity

Nobody in my view is exempt from this gender stuff and messaging

Well no, but that doesn't mean that "gender identity" is a real concept.

Well that’s how they’ve decided to identify themselves but again if they think that happened in a vaccuum and was becuase of some innate feeling they’d be wrong

What be kind is gender identity now? Give over thats just nonsense.
Its now clear that you are on a wind up trying to derail the thread so I'll be ignoring your goady aren't I so much better than you silly women posts

Okay, so what do you think causes this?

Good idea. I shall also disengage.

And yet, where is the OP?

🧐🤔

I’ve told you. Brainwashing.
im an ardent left winger so you won’t like my theory but…
trans people spend so much money on surgery and hormones etc. why not let them if it lines your pockets?

Essentialising and hardening what is really fleeting and mutable feelings and emotions. They've built an industry on it!

But calling it an "identity", and a "gender identity" specifically, suggests a degree of coherence that simply may not be there.
For example: I like to read. I and large numbers of people around the world would not code that as "gendered" in any way. But a teenage boy rebelling against school might code reading as a sissy activity for girls and me as feminine for liking it. And the men who shot Malala Yousafzai might code my desire to read as transgressively masculine. So is a love of reading part of my "gender identity" or not? What and who decides which of my numerous characteristics and preferences are eligible for inclusion in the "gender identity" bundle and which aren't? And since none of that is actually what makes me a woman or not a woman anyway, why carve out a subset of one's personality traits and "identify" with it? It seems an odd sort of proceeding.

Who goes around telling men to be kind, that men are the nice ones etc? Be kind is be submissive dressed up in modern speak

I just don’t know but I find it hard to believe how you define and relate to yourself happens in a vacuum. Everyone has lots of identities - racial, job, gender, etc. I might not think about my race often as a white woman but my racial identity exists and I can’t opt out of that while racism exists

OP seems to have plopped and run…

So doesn't this mean that your sex identity also exists and you can't opt out of it by claiming to have an opposite sex 'gender identity'?

If a man can have a woman gender identity, why can't a white person have a black racial identity?

No.
Gender is a social construct not a biological thing like sex. Gender norms change over time and between cultures. Gender identity is not innate. You aren't born with it. When and where you are born and grow up shapes that rather than it originating within you naturally and independent of societal influences.

I'm somewhat reminded of the bunch of 'feminist' philosophers who pushed the TRA crap so underhandedly.

Dog whistles anyone?

I have one identity - me