Kelly v Leonardo Employment Tribunal 29th September 10am

[ickky]

Hello

Don't know much about this case other than Naomi Cunningham is representing Ms Kelly.

If you want to observe send an email to

[email protected]

Subject line

Ms BM Kelly v Leonardo UK Limited Employment Tribunal – hearing Case number: 8001497/2024

Ask for the link and pin to observe.

State you are a member of the public and give your full name and the email address you will use to access the tribunal.

Anyone interested?

From TT

NC [ref] What did you expect to happen after that?
MK: We discussed modifying some of the toilets, the secret squirrel toilets, I'd expected that to happen by about August, because it had taken a year to get that far.

MK: So my understanding was, policy would not change, company didn't think we needed single sex loos, but they would sort out a loo or two to work differently, to be single occupancy. Expected that by August / September
NC: When was it done?
MK January basically before usable.

Would they make it so difficult for a man with prostate problems to get some privacy in the loo?

Would they make him lay out in graphic detail what the issues were!

Would they fuck!

From TT

NC: [ref] this is response from [sound very poor]
J: [is asking a Q - can't hear well]

From TT

NC: This paragraph and the next couple - remind yourself what they say. How did they make you feel?
MK: There was a sentence in my grievance that I "must not misgender" and then I got this letter - I was crying for about a week. I had been there 17 odd years and then this.

17 years service, going through menopause and being threatened for asking for her rights. What absolute [redacted] [redacteds]

This is awful to see. What you don't get from TT is that she is sobbing, barely able to get the words out about the shame and humiliation she felt at having to explain yet again in detail to men about having to stand up with blood on her skirt and walk across a room full of men to find a women only toilet.

wow this is making my blood boil

From TT

MK: I felt threatened. Being told I couldn't crowdfund for any action bcs wd bring company into disrepute. Told I was likely to breach personal confidentiality. I felt I would lose my job. I felt very threatened. Was stunned.
MK So after that I went to take legal advice.

NC: One final Q that may be upsetting. Can you tell tribunal on how R stance on who could use women's toilets changed between when you first because aware, up to now?

Ooh ooh ooh!

My guess...

FUCKING ARSEHOLES

From TT

MK: Have always wanted to get more women into engineering - in theory Leonardo wanted this too. But all this undermines that, and for the sake of a few men that want to be called women. This removes safety and dignity from women.

I'm not a violent person but I'm currently feeling the urge to break things.

From TT

MK: In my grievance - I asked them not call me 'cis' but then I get this letter. Company was saying it was supporting women, menopause work - but then this. I had been asking to set up a women's network for some time but got nowhere. Company was not supporting me - hypocritical. I considered leaving.

Each one of these tribunals seems to get worse and worse in what they make the claimant go through.

This has destroyed her hasn't it. It's like she's stuck in a nightmare she can't wake up from.

From TT

NC: The judgment in FWS in April 2025 confirmed that for the EA2010 men who identify as women still count as men. Did you expect anything from R then?

MK: I thought they would acknowledge it, communicate with staff, revert to having some women only toilet. A few weeks after a colleague of mine had a couple of 'trans' staff (one male one female) ask her about what loo to use. There was still no policy.

There is a picture of Barbie Kardashian on another thread. Could that be slid into the bundle as an example of what MK is afraid of? I mean, we all know what we’re up against, but some people still think trans identifying men are poor little oppressed things.

NC uses silences so well.

Leonardo UK has an incredible network of University partners. What a [redacted] waste of all the prior investment to develop women in STEM. The public money that is spent of bringing STEM girls up through school and HE. And then industry shits on them from a great height for the sake of affirming a handful of narcissistic self-absorbed men.

From TT

MK: We said the trans staff should consult HR for reassurance. The only response was 'we are consulting the Pride network and the union', was all.

MK: And then at some point there was a questionnaire to all staff about how they felt about the ruling. I've never heard of staff being consulted on a legal matter like this. Felt as if there was a bias - pride network trying to stir up opposition.

WTAF?!!

The only response was 'we are consulting the Pride network and the union', was all.

It's the fucking law! From the highest court in the land!

And if it had gone the other way, no doubt they would have screamed it from the rooftops, not consulted with the women's network and the union. (what women's network???)

I'm just comparing Kate Searle's I've just fucked myself and need a break distress the other week to the absolutely distraught woman in front of me who is carrying on regardless of her distress.

Consultation exerise - Shades of the Hampstead Ponds. This is looking to be an important case to stamp out some of the attempts to evade FWS. No coincidence that it's NC involved. Her opponent KC does not appear to be experienced in discrimination law, so she will need to have done a lot of work on this. Had to edit, too cross to type properly

From TT

MK: And about the same time there was stuff from Unite complaining about the SC ruling. This was about 3 months after it. Felt as if the official attitude was, we are going to ignore it. I felt very undermined.

NC: [ref]
MK: Yes that's the questionnaire.

NC: [ref]
MK Yes that's the communication from Unite.

NC: [ref] bottom para - says 'difficult time for some colleagues, if you need support -' who do you think that is intended for?
MK: I assume, staff who had been using toilets of the opposite sex.

NC: How did you feel
MK: I felt frustrated if I'm honest - excluded.

NC: [ref] tell us what this is?

For those watching, the Judge I think, or a panel member has got up without ceremony to provide tissues and tidy the table for Maria.

From TT

[pause to mop up a water spill and open a window]

MK: I felt threatened. Being told I couldn't crowdfund for any action bcs wd bring company into disrepute.

Wankers.

Reminds me of JR asking SP who was paying her legal fees, as if it was any of her or NHS Fife's fucking business.

These tossers want to subjugate women and get mighty cross when the women have the nerve to think about standing up for themselves.

'How dare you find the money to challenge us, woman!'