Kelly v Leonardo Employment Tribunal 29th September 10am

[ickky]

Hello

Don't know much about this case other than Naomi Cunningham is representing Ms Kelly.

If you want to observe send an email to

[email protected]

Subject line

Ms BM Kelly v Leonardo UK Limited Employment Tribunal – hearing Case number: 8001497/2024

Ask for the link and pin to observe.

State you are a member of the public and give your full name and the email address you will use to access the tribunal.

Anyone interested?

I wonder if the blond lady in the audience is a journalist? She is taking notes!

Do we know the sex of the other two panel members?

It's worse.

NC continues with her questions

What’s to stop a TIM going into a breastfeeding private room with his ‘expressing’ equipment at a workplace that says, basically, that he can pretend to be a woman and access all areas?

do we know who Leonardo are calling as a witness

From TT

we begin]

NC: page 31.
NC: paras b to g of the claim - series of generalisations about men and women. So first - says women in general more fearful of men than vice versa. Why do you believe this?

We know very little about this tribunal, just what we hear the witnesses saying.

Hopefully adherence to the law as clarified by the SC would stop him? Or at least make it demonstrably wrong for him to be there.

Update:
'Breastfeeding rooms: the good men stay out so the bad men stand out'
🙄

From TT

MK: Statistically men commit more violence than women [cites gov crime stats] Men are taller stronger - we all know this. And the statistics show this.

NC: [asks re second para - missed]
NC: Also you say men much more likely to commit sexual crime including voyeurism etc. Anything to add re sexual crime particularly?
MK: [cites figures from Rape Crisis and others]

NC: And re women's use of toilets?
MK: We have to undress much more - need more space especially if we have children with us. Deal with menstruation

From TT

NC [inaudible]
MK: It's not just 'a toilet'. Menstruation - issues with breast milk post partum. It's just a question of bodies
NC: And why do you say women are more modest than men about this?

The crappy microphone is making this hard to listen to.

C's voice is less clear to me than it was this morning. It's like a radio that makes me want to adjust the tuning.

Has anyone else found that?

Yes I can't believe it hasn't been replaced during the breaks.

I can't bear this. She's so upset by what they've done to her. It's cruel.

From TT

MK: Well - just the way men talk about what they do in the toilet - very open. Whereas women try to be as silent as possible always. It's just very different hearin gmen discuss it from hearing women talk.

NC: And how much comfort men compared to women about exposing their bodies?
MK: I think out hiking behind a bush is about the only time women would feel OK disrobing when cd be seen - [is emotional]

From TT

NC: So the grievance process - can you tell tribunal
MK: Well first meeting, was me and three men - having to discuss all the things I've said here. One of the men was my supporter I took - have known him 2 years, we'd never discussed any of this.

MK: Company had been running all 'menopause awareness' posters so I couldn't believe I was having to discuss all this so personally and in such detail.
MK: Took a whole year just to get confirmation of policy.

Yes, and this is NC asking the questions.

I hope that ST (initials interesting re today's proceedings) is equally careful. It wouldn't look good if she isn't.

From TT

MK: I just hadn't wanted to have to talk about all this sort of thing at all, having to do it made me feel ashamed.
MK: Walking through an office of men, maybe blood on my chair, on my trousers, it should not be shame but it is shame.

MK: To get to a toilet that won't have men in - I have to walk a good way, through very public area. And meanwhile the company is all 'menopause awareness'. It's ridiculous.

Her employers in their quest to be inclusive have no idea, or worse just don't give a fuck, of how utterly reprehensible their Insistence on men being women is.

From TT

NC: [page] is this the correspondence with colleague after that meeting?
MK: Yes this is it. I mention it taking a year to get to the point of even getting told, and then having to go through why women should have single sex toilets.

Rainbow lanyards, tho…

From TT

NC: This is quite a long email.
MK: I think I was in work - it says 3pm. I don't think I was home. I remember crying a lot. Annoyed I had to explain it all AGAIN. I've been an engineer 20 years - have never had to lay out personal things like this. A degree of shame too.

Quite, the lanyardocracy strikes again. No need to think about anything else once you've handed out lanyards.

It just seems that big and small employers are continuing to flout the law, including multimillion pound and multinational companies and corporations, and all they face is a pesky employment tribunal.

The women OTOH face untold stress, reputational besmirchments, and career damage.

Such a disproportionate burden falls on the party that didn’t break the law.