NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #45

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence had been intended to be 28 July with 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing was to have ended on 30 July. However, it became apparent as the hearing progressed that this schedule wouldn't be followed. (Considerable understatement.)

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 42: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379820-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-42 25 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 43: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379979-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-43 25 July 2025 to 27 July 2025
Thread 44: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5380196-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-44 25 July 2025 to 28 July 2025

OMG what possessed Lindsay to actually go as a witness against her friend?
They must be friends or they wouldn't holiday together

This ^ NC has MG and CE - who does JR have?

jR has only added to the vendetta optics NC has unpicked and laid bare. As Foran said it is absolutely astonishing.

Thank goodness they don't! I start work at 10...if I was reading at 9 am, I would be late 🫩

I don't think Vic's evidence is really that important to the case, so not worth hearing and examining through questions from either side. Probably less relevant than ever after the SC judgment. She's female, but would prefer not to be.

The perfect victim has been around for a long time. Check out Claudette Colver who predated Rosa Parks. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claudette_Colvin

Well I hate to break it to you but I got in there first and she's already taken

Bet NHS Fife wish their staff group chats stuck to how to make jam and how to bake a good scone......................

like i said people have difference in humour and thats probably what she will say they were jokes and nothing more she didnt make them up, its like my favourite joke of jimmy carrs is a domestic violence joke and i heard it and laughed at it while i was in a terribly violent relationship just because i find this joke humourous doesnt mean i in any way shape or form agree with domestic violence!
so i think thats probably how SP will defend it..

I might have missed it but didn't LN said that she thought being gay was different from being trans, because being trans wasn't a choice... ? Seems an odd view to have.

OK good point fair enough

I wonder if their funder is also funding this case and is not impressed, so encoraged them to make a statement? I agree, if they have a witness up tomorrow (taken a call from an NHS Fife employee who has given them what info?) it might have been wise to wheesht.

I assume they start much earlier than 10 discussing issues in private.

Cardinal Richelieu:
If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him

I'm glad that it's unlikely anyone will ever analyse everything I've said or written over the last 7 years. I reckon that out of context you would find something that could be considered to be racist, sexist, homophobic, transphobic* and generally just unpleasant.

*Everything is transphobic.

Do you think kimono fox killer is watching all this and thinking well we won’t be instructing JR ? I suspect not but 🤷‍♀️

I think they are wanting to remind people there is no perfect victim but her rights still stand.

I really hope Sandie comes and apologises for these Pakistani flooding jokes tomorrow as they were in very poor taste/racist jokes.

Did they agree there were some other women who stepped forward to support her about the changing room?

LN said she wanted SP struck off, according to the Herald.

Wasn't JR at one time proposing to call Vic Valentine - IIRC from the Scottish Trans Alliance?

So she has a huge cheek complaining about NC's witness list being "campaigning"

Whatever happened to Vic's witness testimony?

😂. (Oophs that the emoji that LN will refrain from using again)

LN really wanted to blacken SP's character didn't she. Making out that "the world needs to know what sort of person she is"

This

the absolutism is nonsense. There is no group of people that is all good. But this is part of the PR job that has been done on us. The ‘most marginalised and vulnerable’ bullshit that people like LN swallows.

Vic Valentine from the Equality Network? Dunno what VV or the Equality Network have to do with this mess, I'm curious but seems it doesn't affect the case so I may never find out. VV is probably relieved to be well out of it after this.

Can a legal bod give an opinion on what argument any of this today could have (even theoretically) contributed to, other than:

• SP was heading for a suspension anyway because she was nasty (not something they have actually argued and anyway the recent investigation showed nothing)
• SP is racist therefore must also be transphobic and therefore was only acting out of hostility to DU and not because she believes only F people should be in F changing room?
• SP is nasty therefore doesn't matter what we did, she deserved it?

Obviously none of these are competent arguments against what is being brought.

Oh yes, it was when Naomi said that gays are just being themselves in a male CR, but trans using a female CR is a choice.

It was to this she said trans isn't a choice iirc.

I’ve missed loads today being busy with other stuff. Off to catch up.