NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #23

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It is planned that it will resume on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

However, as a result of problems with the livestreaming, apparently caused by a very large number of observers, remote public access to the hearing was suspended on Tuesday 11 February. It was suggested that it might be reinstated at some point but don't count on it.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10
Thread 11: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272046-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-11
Thread 12: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272276-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-12
Thread 13: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272398-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-13
Thread 14: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272939-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-14
Thread 15: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273119-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-15
Thread 16: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273636-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-16
Thread 17: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273827-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-17
Thread 18: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5274332-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-18
Thread 19: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5274571-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-19
Thread 20: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5275782-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-20
Thread 21: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5276925-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-21
Thread 22: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5280174-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-22

It's going to end up on the shelves beside the toilet paper in every supermarket I visit.

I don't know if this has been posted already

https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/viewpoint/24925734.shouldnt-pay-public-sector-staff-full-time-trans-activists/

It has been archived but I forgot to copy the link.

https://archive.ph/u9uE8

Not sure if the link will work 🤞

It worked for me 👍

😃 it didn't work for me when I tried it so I deleted it. I didn't want to waste anyone's time.

Thank you for reposting it.

Eta

To save a double post I found this comment piece in today's Telegraph

https://archive.ph/qoDV3

Remembered the link this time. About tra capture of the unions and how this contributes to the cowardice and batshittery of many Labour MPs.

Well said, Calum! What a better world we'd live in if people just did the bloody job they were paid to do, instead of using their position as a platform from which to lecture the public.

Public data should not conflate sex and gender, review says - BBC News

A government spokesperson said "We have always been at war with Eastasia. It's just common sense."

GMC Response to complaint: What an utter cop-out

The GMC cannot consider any investigation into concerns which are still subject to statutory or legal
processes or provide any comment on them. The concerns you have raised, which are subject to
ongoing matters being considered by the Tribunal, duplicate those that we have received from
another complainant. As such, we regret to inform you that we won’t be able to update you as to the
outcome of our considerations.

That's a bit of a non sequitur. They can't update you because someone else complained first?

@Igneococcushave you been on Boaty McBoatface? 🤣

Funny I got thr same response I wonder if we put the same complaint in or if it's a standard response

I suspect they are sending the same response out to everyone who complained....

MAKING DONATIONS TO SEX MATTERS:
I think it was on this thread that, back in the mists of time, when dinosaurs roamed the earth - oh wait...... there was a discussion about making a concerted gesture of appreciation for SP's legal eagles, Margaret Gribbon and Naomi Cunningham. I suggested a 'mass donation' to a relevant organisation, identifying the donations as related to SP/NC/MG by means of a 'coded' comment, like we did with donations in memory of SP's father, RIP.

Somebody pointed out that NC is Chair of the Board of Trustees of Sex Matters, making that a good match - obvs there are other worthy causes, but focusing on one is the way to make an impact.

I asked Sex Matters if it is possible to comment anonymously, and they've just got back to say they don't think so, which is what I thought.
So if you don't want your name to appear with your donation, it looks like you can't have a comment onscreen.

That puts the kybosh on my 'mass donations with coded FWR comments' plan, but we can always tell Sex Matters that if they see a flurry of donations, they are our way of saluting NC and MG

I've just planted some seeds at Donate to Sex Matters - Sex Matters.

@Tallisker I've never been on Boaty McBoatface, she's been at anker just off shore of my house for a few days a few years back but that is as close as I got. I have been six weeks at sea on the boat that found the Titanic though and been on the same shift during that time as the ROV pilot who operated the ROV when they found her.
@Peregrina there was always a good mix of scientists on the cruises I've been on, oceanographers, geochemists, geologists, seafloor mappers, without them you wouldn't find new vent fields. It's amazing to watch how they figure out where it is worth diving or deploying an ROV based on minute changes in H2 concentrations in the water and their knowledge of ocean currents.

Sorry if this one has already been posted:
https://archive.is/NzciO

Remarkable that these articles on the Peggie case keep coming weeks after Part 1 finished. Not your typical ET coverage?!

It does feel like there's traction with this one. And in some ways it may be a blessing in disguise that there will be this long hiatus and then it'll start up again - not just because the Supreme Court judgment may come in that time (and hopefully go FWS's way), but because the noise has only died away to a limited extent and the SG are coming under pressure (props to Pam Gosal) to clarify various issues. So in July the whole knotty area will still be relatively live.

The Tories are the voice of reason here, aren't they?

I think it's largely opportunistic, but yes.

True, it's an easy win for them.

Maybe - but I only recently discovered that Theresa May was the one who started the Stonewall funding cancellation. And getting Incels on the Prevent list. And Kent Badenoch gathering evidence on self ID policy. So they’ve been chipping away for a while. But without something like the Peggie case to act as a lightning rod for the public it’s difficult to get things moving. Anyway they’re having a go now and for that I’ll be thankful even if it’s just expediency

Yes they have been from the start as sad as that is

It was repeatedly said here before the recent elections, that much as one might dislike the Conservatives, they were doing something to stop the trans onslaught, whereas Labour seemed likely to welcome it. Or to do some sympathetic bleating that would amount to nothing.

Well, the Tories made themselves so unpopular that the trans issue wasn't very important to most voters when the day came. We've got to live with the result.

So Kemi Badenoch is the what, 4th woman leader of the Tories? Meanwhile it's always men on top among the socialists.

Yes. When Christian Blunt and Penny Mordant were lecturing GCs and calling us “so called feminists” when we were opposing Self ID, the Tories weren’t looking so supportive.

Trouble is, most of this happened on the Tories' watch. They could have stopped it back then.

That's true, and it goes to show, although some might try to twist this into a Left v Right template, it doesn't really fit. Right-wing Tories could be (and are, in some cases) gender enthusiasts too. It's cut across all parties and all political convictions.