Page 4 | Kemi is on the case!

SleekMamma · 2023-04-04T15:39:05+00:00

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/32012712-d2ef-11ed-b1cd-5223fe349502?shareToken=f8d230bb699c280b7ebafca5e872e305 Go Kemi Go Kemi

zen1 · 04/04/2023 22:53

ScrollingLeaves · 04/04/2023 20:42

zen1 · Today 18:50
Good ideas in principle, but in the time that it takes this to be ‘considered’, the Tories will probably be voted out of office. We need some action now.

A certain MtF transgender barrister is asserting it can’t come to anything for the reason you say. (ResisterRex posted this on the EHRC thread.)

https://twitter.com/moira_robin/status/1643315530995048450?s=46&t=WHoOZ_3Kv5G6-FyQuvE0LQ

I would love nothing more than for RMW (she/her) to be wrong.

DemiColon · 04/04/2023 22:55

dimorphism · 04/04/2023 18:02

Ah so, when we look at actual facts and evidence it seems she is yet another woman smeared as far right with lies.

There's a pattern emerging

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TBH I think most o the people that say these things would look like deer in the headlights if you asked them what Roger Scrunton thought, or who Thomas Sowell is, or what traditional conservative political thinking includes.

Their top level thinking is that to be a conservative someone has to hate the poor and want to advantage the rich, and they don't really differentiate between right and far right.

ScrollingLeaves · 04/04/2023 22:57

Bustarold · Today 17:40

Does Kemi stand up for all women including refugees, single mothers, homeless women? The Tories are gaslighting feminists, throwing us red meat while ignoring urgent and pressing issues that affect women every day. They don't care about women or anyone who's not privileged, but let's keep clapping our hands because they "know what a woman is", eh?
They are vile.

I thought this post made some good points in relation to what you say:

ValancyRedfern · Today 20:33
Kemi is great. As previously noted, her views are pretty mainstream Christian views and typical of the UK Nigerian diaspora population.

As to the question of whether she'll help single mothers or those on benefits etc. Etc. Women living in poverty are much more likely to go to prison, so this will help them. Women living in poverty are much more likely to need a refuge if they are victims of dv, so this will help them. Women living in poverty won't be able to afford private hospitals or private social care, so this will help them. It's middle class women, who know they will never go to prison, never need a shelter, be able to pay for their own care and private rooms in hospital, who are willing to shaft poorer women in the name of inclusivity

ilovesooty · 04/04/2023 22:58

Bustarold · 04/04/2023 17:40

Does Kemi stand up for all women including refugees, single mothers, homeless women? The Tories are gaslighting feminists, throwing us red meat while ignoring urgent and pressing issues that affect women every day. They don't care about women or anyone who's not privileged, but let's keep clapping our hands because they "know what a woman is", eh?
They are vile.

Couldn't agree more.

OneMorePlant · 04/04/2023 23:01

ScrollingLeaves · 04/04/2023 22:57

Bustarold · Today 17:40

Does Kemi stand up for all women including refugees, single mothers, homeless women? The Tories are gaslighting feminists, throwing us red meat while ignoring urgent and pressing issues that affect women every day. They don't care about women or anyone who's not privileged, but let's keep clapping our hands because they "know what a woman is", eh?
They are vile.

I thought this post made some good points in relation to what you say:

ValancyRedfern · Today 20:33
Kemi is great. As previously noted, her views are pretty mainstream Christian views and typical of the UK Nigerian diaspora population.

As to the question of whether she'll help single mothers or those on benefits etc. Etc. Women living in poverty are much more likely to go to prison, so this will help them. Women living in poverty are much more likely to need a refuge if they are victims of dv, so this will help them. Women living in poverty won't be able to afford private hospitals or private social care, so this will help them. It's middle class women, who know they will never go to prison, never need a shelter, be able to pay for their own care and private rooms in hospital, who are willing to shaft poorer women in the name of inclusivity

Totally agree. This will help so many women who need it the most.

Love Kemi!

Foreversearch · 04/04/2023 23:08

spannasaurus · 04/04/2023 20:18

So clarifying sex means biological sex means a transman, like a women, can use a man as a comparator. However, it conversely means a transwoman’s comparator would be a woman.
If a transwomen was paid less than a man couldn't they claim discrimination on the basis of gender reassignment. Would the comparator then be a man who hasn't undergone gender reassignment

@spannasaurus this is where the wheels come off.

If TW are being paid the same as their female colleagues they are not being discriminated against due to gender reassignment I.e. they are being treated the same as all other women. They can’t claim gender reassignment discrimination if they are paid less than a man because they are a biological male.

If sex means biological sex a TW can only get equal pay if women get equal pay using a male comparator and then the TW claim equal pay using the women as their female comparator.

spannasaurus · 04/04/2023 23:22

Foreversearch · 04/04/2023 23:08

@spannasaurus this is where the wheels come off.

If TW are being paid the same as their female colleagues they are not being discriminated against due to gender reassignment I.e. they are being treated the same as all other women. They can’t claim gender reassignment discrimination if they are paid less than a man because they are a biological male.

If sex means biological sex a TW can only get equal pay if women get equal pay using a male comparator and then the TW claim equal pay using the women as their female comparator.

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If a TW can show they are being paid less than a man and the only difference between them and the other man is gender reassignment then they could claim on that basis.( If sex is biological sex) Why would they need to refer to the separate protected characteristic of sex

spannasaurus · 04/04/2023 23:31

spannasaurus · 04/04/2023 23:22

If a TW can show they are being paid less than a man and the only difference between them and the other man is gender reassignment then they could claim on that basis.( If sex is biological sex) Why would they need to refer to the separate protected characteristic of sex

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Unless the comparator for gender reassignment is a person of either sex who hasn't undergone gender reassignment.

Foreversearch · 04/04/2023 23:33

@spannasaurus i get your point, but they would still have to first prove they were doing work of equal value, which is the equal pay test a woman has to meet. A TW who is a cleaner couldn’t use gender reassignment for not being paid the same as a male CEO.

spannasaurus · 04/04/2023 23:35

Foreversearch · 04/04/2023 23:33

@spannasaurus i get your point, but they would still have to first prove they were doing work of equal value, which is the equal pay test a woman has to meet. A TW who is a cleaner couldn’t use gender reassignment for not being paid the same as a male CEO.

But a female cleaner couldn't claim discrimination on the basis of sex for not being paid the same as a male CEO either

spannasaurus · 04/04/2023 23:37

Sorry foreversearch didn't read your post properly. I agree with you on that point

Foreversearch · 04/04/2023 23:47

spannasaurus · 04/04/2023 23:35

But a female cleaner couldn't claim discrimination on the basis of sex for not being paid the same as a male CEO either

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@spannasaurus it’s ok, I’m not explaining this well as it’s late.

Hoardasurass · 05/04/2023 00:28

I am loving this finally all the stupid Scottish gender laws are beginning to pay off for women from the equal representation Bill all the way through to the grr. I guess we all owe sturgeon, Harvey, slater and Co a great big thank you for pushing this nonsense so far that Westminster can't ignore it anymore. Along with all the women who have been highlighting it for years.
I do worry about how much more damage useless will cause before he gets the boot but not long now especially with the latest rapist getting to walk free and the tories up here literally saying I told you so again about another scot gov policy that has had a very public horrendous consequences for women and girls

Slothtoes · 05/04/2023 06:02

Just placemarking really, need time to read up on this. First thoughts great, the sex matters petition is great. if this announcement is a reflection of that, and Tories have accepted it, then also great that’s something to leverage before the 2024 election with all the other parties and their commitment to women’s rights.
Secondly that this surely has to go hand in hand with GRA reform/repeal? How would it work without that?

thebaneofmylifeisacat · 05/04/2023 06:29

Excellent

Kier helooooooooow!!

Slothtoes · 05/04/2023 07:04

Also will this be followed or accompanied by campaigning for third space?

MarshaBradyo · 05/04/2023 08:08

Rishi Sunak was mentioned wrt this on R4 this am

I didn’t catch it all but hopefully means it’s happening

Meanwhile Starmer ‘no one is talking about it’ plonker

EmotionalSupportHyena · 05/04/2023 08:08

Slothtoes · 05/04/2023 07:04

Also will this be followed or accompanied by campaigning for third space?

Hopefully! Stonewall are very well placed to run such a campaign!

ResisterRex · 05/04/2023 08:17

Bustarold · 04/04/2023 17:40

Does Kemi stand up for all women including refugees, single mothers, homeless women? The Tories are gaslighting feminists, throwing us red meat while ignoring urgent and pressing issues that affect women every day. They don't care about women or anyone who's not privileged, but let's keep clapping our hands because they "know what a woman is", eh?
They are vile.

You are absolutely right. We must sit tight and wait for a Labour government to Do This The Correct Way.

How will they protect women as a sex class? I'm all ears 😃

beastlyslumber · 05/04/2023 08:19

Go Kemi! She is awesome. I really think the tories missed a trick by not electing her leader. But anyway, this is excellent news and I'm optimistic that she'll follow through. She isn't stupid enough to be taken in by the left's lies and she's had enough of their abuse to know what they're about.

AHyenaofMN · 05/04/2023 08:20

As we know Labour will be very busy with more important manly stuff so we are required to shush and go and make some tea.

It's for The Cause. The men, not the few, I think is their slogan?

Georgiepud · 05/04/2023 08:23

Good, good, good.
That's KS, and the SNP under a bus.

twitterexile · 05/04/2023 08:35

Wonderingiforifnot · 04/04/2023 22:45

This is so important. Why does fear of trans women dominate some areas of Mumsnet?

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Men harm women in many ways - TW are men. Get it now?

twitterexile · 05/04/2023 08:38

AHyenaofMN · 05/04/2023 08:20

As we know Labour will be very busy with more important manly stuff so we are required to shush and go and make some tea.

It's for The Cause. The men, not the few, I think is their slogan?

So very accurate.

EmotionalSupportHyena · 05/04/2023 08:39

beastlyslumber · 05/04/2023 08:19

Go Kemi! She is awesome. I really think the tories missed a trick by not electing her leader. But anyway, this is excellent news and I'm optimistic that she'll follow through. She isn't stupid enough to be taken in by the left's lies and she's had enough of their abuse to know what they're about.

She’s young, I reckon she’ll be leader one day.

Bit of a tangent but it keeps the thread bumped…

I wonder if the smearing of Kemi as ‘far right of the party’ came from outside or within the Tory ranks?
Just thinking about how the Head Girls of Feminism were the initial source of the smears transactivists use against Posie…perhaps the mischaracterisation of Kemi also started with her own side? She’s very popular with the ordinary Tory membership and with non Tory normies - that’s probably gained her a few jealous enemies within the Old-Boys-Proper-Schools-Billionaire-Tories?

(New name - same old cryptofascistwomble, btw!)