Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 3

[ickky]

The Tribunal started on 25th April at 10am. If you would like to view online you need to send a request for access as early as possible.

Send an email to

[email protected]

The subject heading of the email request should read

“MEDIA OR PUBLIC ACCESS REQUEST – Case number 2202172/2020 - Ms A Bailey – 25th April 2022.

Then ask for the pin for the online access.
You will be contacted with instructions on how to observe the hearing.

When joining the live tribunal

On the first page underneath where you put your screen name, select the video and mic that are not crossed out (top option), this is the courts vid and mic.

On the next page select NONE on the drop down windows for vid and mic, these are your own video and mic.

You must be muted so as to not disturb the hearing.

There is also live tweeting from

twitter.com/tribunaltweets

Abbreviations:
AB: Allison Bailey, claimant
BC: Ben Cooper QC, barrister for AB
SW = Stonewall Equality Limited (respondent 1)
IO = Ijeoma Omambala QC, barrister for SW
RW = Robin White assisting IO
GC = Garden Court Chambers Limited (respondent 2) (GCC would be a better abbreviation)
AH = Andrew Hochhauser QC, barrister for GC
JR = Jane Russell assisting AH
RM= Rajiv Menon QC & SH = Stephanie Harrison QC (jointly respondent 3 along with all members of GC except AB)
EJ = Employment Judge Goodman hearing the case
Panel = any one of the three panel members (EJ and two lay members)

Thread 1
www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4529887-Allison-Bailey-v-Stonewall-Employment-Tribunal-hearing?

Thread 2

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4542466-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-2

Oh KM off on a rant about transwomen

A nice line of argument. The tweets might have been firmly expressed but didn't contain hate and the only reason that GCC was able in some way to discern tweets that were "hateful" was because any hate has been incorporated by KM.

@JulesRimetStillGleaming definitely not but it's surely unfair on AB's team to be limited like this

KM is awfully concerned about safety of everyone except women - we don't get to prioritise our safety

KM: being worried about bad men is transphobic.

It is a tragedy KM is only available for an afternoon. A full day would have helped AB so much more.

100% agree. The threats of violence aren't coming from the GC/rad fems. Its all from gender ideology followers yet they say that they're unsafe.

I'm reminded of the ploppers on this board when I read KM's answers. No substance, no evidence, just hyperbole and nonsense.

It strikes me as unfair to limit time when allocated time has been spent rearranging chairs and what not.

I think KM's support solicitor does not like this line of questioning

I am fascinated about how the other teams are going to redirect this

Is KM trans?

KM: Transwomen don't have male bodies. They have transwomen's bodies.

KM's view, in a nutshell, everything's transphobic. In fact holding a different opinion from KM is transphobic.

The full madness is coming out now. Transwomen have transwomen's bodies and only they know what they are.

Yes. Head of trans inclusion and they/he pronouns.

Is KM trans?

I presume he's "non binary"

IO should not be testifying.

BC: It is a fact that women are disproportionally vulnerable to male violence
KM: cis men are violent to women including TW
BC: men will go to all sorts of lengths to abuse women
KM: that's transphobic

🤦

I am just watching KM double-down with my mouth open.
Does he/they have any idea how unhinged they sound?

And I can understand the emotional support person. I can understand the emotional support dog. I can understand the extra breaks. But all these and KM's Mum?

A few women on Twitter have made the point that they didn't get anywhere near this level of support when they gave evidence at their rapist's trial. No support, no breaks. Nothing.

It's such an article of faith, that most people aren't even aware that they are supposed to adhere to, arguably.

@yourhairiswinterfire I was about to post the same thing. Cheering on BC at the moment. Wish I was logged in and watching.

KM: referring to transwomen as male is inherently transphobic and abusive.

Kinell...
BC: you define woman as anyone including men who say they are women
KM: bodies are not inherently male or female. They are just their bodies

That tweet??? How can that possibly be construed as endangering trans people?

Stonewall team intervene quite shoutily to try to shut KM's torrent of 'everything's transphobic and threatening and abusive' madness up. EJG says actually tribunal is interested to find out about what it was that KM feared would happen to transpeople visiting GCC.

It's utterly mind boggling