Scottish census decision

[IsitM]

"The Scottish Court of Session has ruled in favour of the Scottish Government in the judicial review of guidance to accompany "the sex question” in the 2022 Scottish census

We are disappointed with the judgment and will be requesting an urgent appeal"

From FPFW

twitter.com/fairplaywomen/status/1494315619877109781?s=20&t=3b061zOq4q3XIBtz7MWV5A

Datun
One of the reasons he couldn't define sex because sex and gender have been used interchangeably.

The Judge quoted the Supreme Court
"In Elan-Cane, the Court had referred (at paragraph 5) to the fact that,
subject to the inclusion of transgender persons within the category of their acquired gender,
public agencies tended to use the terms “gender” and “sex” interchangeably to refer to the biological categories of male and female, and had made the same point in more general
terms at paragraph 52"
and
"Ultimately, at least for now, the recent observations in paragraphs 5 and 52 of the Supreme
Court judgment in Elan-Cane, that the terms “gender” and “sex” have been used essentially
interchangeably in various forms of legal and non-legal discourse, hold good."

That is the point I picked up on. The use of sex and gender interchangeably means that the Judge is able to argue that the word sex encompasses both biological sex and gender identity because both sex and gender have been used to describe biological sex so he is arguing the reverse must also be true if they are synonyms then it works both ways.

Posted to soon

This is why it is absolutely vital that we push for accurate language in legislation, regulations etc. Gender should never be used as an alternative for sex they are two different things.

too soon

@ChazsBrilliantAttitude

Posted to soon

This is why it is absolutely vital that we push for accurate language in legislation, regulations etc. Gender should never be used as an alternative for sex they are two different things.

Got it. Sorry, I hadn't read that bit. It's so flimsy, I almost can't believe it. Instead of correcting the ambiguity they're exploiting the fact that it's meaningless.

If people don't think it's entirely deliberate, surely that's got to do it.

How can a court not have seen it essential to define the terms properly?

The conclusion here might be extended to all sorts of euphemisms:
for example, because dying might be called ‘passing’,as a euphemism, ‘passing’ means dying…..,.

Major note here for lawmakers:

Law is going to have to be much more carefully and explicitly worded and definitions wholly pinned down. Because we live in an age of wankers who will exploit every single wobbly spot in their 'queer and smash up everything' mission.

@Lovelyricepudding

What is the point of the sex question when sex no longer has any meaning? The only justification they could give was that most people would use the dictionary definition so it doesn't matter if a few don't. But if the dictionary definition is irrelevant then why ask the question at all? What are they trying to find out from it?

Exactly this. The stupidity is enraging. If men can be women and women can be men, why bother having a sex category at all? It's not going to tell you anything.

On the plus side FWS have just won their appeal. I wonder if that will assist when this is appealed?

It is interesting that losing the first round and winning on appeal is becoming something of a pattern for women.

It is interesting that losing the first round and winning on appeal is becoming something of a pattern for women.

Perhaps it's harder to "educate" judges higher up the judicial hierarchy. Also on average they are probably older and more conservative and less worried about being called a TERF.

Some of these lower court judgements are so woolly and vague. It's as if Stonewall has had a hand in writing them up.

I'm not sure I'd know how to answer this census if I was trans! Say I was a trans woman and wanted to be recorded as such, should I record my sex as male and gender as trans, or sex as female and gender as trans?

It sounds like I could choose to do either, but then no-one knows what any of the data means!

@Artichokeleaves

It is interesting that losing the first round and winning on appeal is becoming something of a pattern for women.

I was reading through what the judge said and he is right. Just like the ruling that it is perfectly legal to house men in the women's estate is perfectly legal. Not because it should be legal but

because no stupid fucker had ever previously actually done it

Until now nobody had ever questioned it so the law, words, haven't been tightly defined enough to rebuff these stupid challenges. We have all always known thatthere are 2 sexes and that human beings cannot change sex. That sex changes is a fiction and referes only to cosmetic and social changes (well, social ones at a very hard push).

So maybe judges are choosing to find in favour of them, shock everyone and get the laws rewritten, the rules tightened up.

But I might just be being to kind, naive...

FPFW have leave to appeal!
Dig for victory

"Fair Play For Women has been granted permission for an urgent appeal of the first instance judgment on the
@scotgov
guidance accompanying the sex question in the Scottish Census.

The appeal will be heard at the Scottish court of Session on WEDNESDAY 23 FEBRUARY"

mobile.twitter.com/fairplaywomen/status/1495025839607537665

The garden is filling up nicely.

Retweet under the #Womenwontwheesht if you can.

Well done to FPFW.

Dug.

Crikey, the appeal is on Wednesday. We won't have long to wait.

Dug

Found some carrots in the garden and threw them in the pot.

I've just dug for the appeal. Seems really important!

Just hit 10k

Just shy of £12k now

It was a sunny afternoon here, good for digging. Let’s hope spring comes soon.

30% raised now!

We shouldn't have to do this to protect our own rights. We shouldn't be forced to dig for what should be given freely to us. It's demeaning. Nevertheless we persist.

@tiphaine It’s true. But we need to enforce a checkmate. And at the moment that means high defence. They need to see us staring at them whichever way they turn.

Dig dig