Brilliant debate on GMB about #RIPJKRowling

[Destinysdaughter]

Just watched it, it featured Benjamin Butterworth, George Galloway and Rose of Dawn. BB got his arse handed to him by Piers and Rose was brilliant! Well worth a watch! It was on at 8.15 so you can watch it in an hours time if you're at home. Also Twitter reactions were v positive, with pp wanting to buy the book as a result!

Oh i felt sorry for button...even though he is a twat

I will work on this problematic part of my personality

I spent most of the clip watching rose, she was awesome when she spoke obviously but my goodness she was giggling 😀

Blatant placemarking

I saw the link to this in the Metro - so many people wanting to know what cis means! I look forward to watching this this evening.

Oh i felt sorry for button...even though he is a twat

Report for reeducation Rufus.

I don't feel a single ounce of sympathy for him. He is a grifter on the gender ideology gravy train and he doesn't care who is harmed by this nonsense.

@RoyalCorgi

It pains me to say it but I think it's people like Piers Morgan who are going to turn this around for us. Loads of women have been working really hard behind the scenes, responding to consultations, holding meetings, writing letters etc but ultimately it's people like Morgan, who is watched by millions of people, who will bring home to the public the insanity of what's happening.

I think you're right in terms of daylight and bringing it to the masses, but the women working behind the scenes are already having an impact. That's why they make some people so very cross.

@PronounssheRa

Corgi

I agree, piers gets the message out to the masses in a way that it is impossible for most women.

He also won't get the kind of horrific abuse that has been levelled at women.

I did love the don't call me cis retort though. I think he knows more about this whole debate than we might have thought.

I agree. Men are treated as ‘telling it as it is’, whereas his female counterpart, (sorry, I don’t know her name, as I don’t watch that program) would have been sacked for being transphobic. I’m not using hyperbole, we all know women are treated more harshly for speaking the truth. He won’t get the abuse JKR is getting.

Very Haddocky.

I think it's people like Piers Morgan who are going to turn this around for us. Loads of women have been working really hard behind the scenes, responding to consultations, holding meetings, writing letters etc but ultimately it's people like Morgan, who is watched by millions of people, who will bring home to the public the insanity of what's happening.

There are various angles to this. We have

1. Loudhailers, who raise the issue, get it out there, prick up the public's ears. I think Posie Parker and JKR are in this camp, as well as Piers Morgan.

1. Experts, who have all the data, statistics, relevant experience, the knowledge and references. I think this covers people like maybe MBM solicitors, Fair Cop, Maya Forstater, Rhona Hotchkiss - anyone with expertise who can offer informed input.

and

1. Translators, who can join the links, explain the problems, express themselves eloquently, cut to the heart of the matter, see the bigger picture. I would say people like Jane Clare Jones, Rachel Rooney, James Kirkup, Glosswitch.

I've missed out absolutely loads of people, and of course there is overlap, but just sketching out an idea.

There's also lots and lots of supporting roles for all of us muggles sitting in cafes (once upon a time) commenting on facebook, talking to our mums, writing letters to our MPs.

It's all needed. It all helps.

Oh I did enjoy that

Susanna and Rose trying desperately and politely not to laugh, Piers and George in growing frustrated disbelief, and the usual over intense, over the top ranting from the wokebloke complete with the pouting, eye rolling and Kevin The Teenager huffs.

I'm continually staggered that this political lobby has all this money, all this tech savvy, and absolutely no concept of public image, PR, or not making a complete twit of itself on national telly.

And again a non-trans male 'ally' stating extremist stuff right in the face of a trans person telling them they don't agree. I have happy memories of India Willoughby handing someone very similar his over intense, highly woke arse.

I think he knows more about this whole debate than we might have thought.

One day I'll make a list of people who are not as stupid as they appear (will include Piers Morgan) and a list of people who are much stupider than they appear (top spot occupied by Jolyon Maugham).

Piers Morgan has been excellent on this issue for quite a while now, he gave Lisa Nandy a good roasting last year when she claimed you couldn't tell the sex of a baby when it's born. He also asked her would it be fair if Usain Bolt decided to identify as a woman, for him to race against women, to which she had no answer! Despite his habit of talking over his guests, he does have that journalistic ability to ask very direct questions, which is probably why not many Tory Mps want to go on GMB at the moment!

And did you also notice Piers said he identified as a feminist?!

Thanks for putting up the YouTube link .

It's a shame that my loathing for Piers Morgan is so deep and unswaying that I can't say I admire him for that interview. He is just a massive, massive, awful, terrible, bellend.

But I thought Rose of Dawn was excellent and George Galloway was interesting.

It's good that light is being shone on this on mainstream television with a large and diverse audience watching.

Good lord. Benjamin thinks he did a good job on GMTV.

"Proud to have stood up for trans people on @GMB against the smears and attacks that try to undermine their existence."

He clearly wasn't paying attention to the transperson who disagreed with him!

Michelle
"I'm continually staggered that this political lobby has all this money, all this tech savvy, and absolutely no concept of public image, PR, or not making a complete twit of itself on national telly."

Isn't the 'official PR message': "SHHHHHH" (or no debate)

Only the ones who don't understand this complex position get to debate on national TV.

I look forward to them noticing it's not working, then I'm sure we'll get some clear and well reasoned arguments.

😂 He was just like Harrop. They had the same look of shock at emerging from their echo chambers and realising that real people in real life have different views and actually expect you to be able to argue your point logically rather than reciting slogans or abuse. He was so shocked at being questioned.

We all know this debate isn't about helping trans people. It's about getting one over on women.

OK, now I am a bit confused.

A distinction seemed to be repeatedly drawn in the interview between transvestites (not true trans) and transgender people.

Yet cross dressers are under the Stonewall definition of trans.

Obviously the act of putting on a garment of the opposite sex does not automatically make you trans - and I have no idea about the 'gender identity' of the individual in a wig and woman's coat in JKR's latest and whether they are written as a guy disguising their appearance or as something else.

But can anyone explain how cross dressing (true trans) is different to being a transvestite (apparently not true trans)?

And, if there is a distinction, where have all the transvestites gone?

Benjamin Button looks (and sounds) like the love child of Harrop and Little Owen Jones.

We're not allowed to discuss it on here, ANew.

@AntsInPenzance

Good lord. Benjamin thinks he did a good job on GMTV.

"Proud to have stood up for trans people on @GMB against the smears and attacks that try to undermine their existence."

He clearly wasn't paying attention to the transperson who disagreed with him!

It’s like things are going through a filter in their minds and they are seeing something completely different from the real world, like a psychosis of some kind. We see BB making a painful tit of himself, him and his followers see a white knight on a charger protecting trans people. I think the filter even filtered out Rose, an actual trans person, telling the truth. It really is a very frightening contagion and it would be funny if behind it serious harm was being done to people in its name.

Yet cross dressers are under the Stonewall definition of trans.

Rose of Dawn explained this.

Stonewall have expanded their definition of trans to include cross dressers/transvestites. That doesn't mean that all trans people agree with Stonewall.

Benjamin getting his arse handed to him on twitter. He just doesn't know when to give in.

twitter.com/benjaminbutter/status/1306169229062922241

Placemarking to watch the footage later