Lisa Nandy says child rapists should be in women’s prisons if they identify as female

[RoyalCorgi]

Extraordinary.

www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=oUon9j1zJ_E&

Is transwomansplaining a thing?

Yes. Yes it is. It's known as 'mansplaining'.

Or transplaining. 😁

I thought of transplaining, but considered transmen were perhaps less likely to do it for some reason I can't quite put my finger on....

So, I got from Lisa Nandy that all women, in all circumstances, have to give up their single sex spaces in order that it might help with the treatment of a few male persons’ gender dysphoria. Have I got that right?

I think that you've got it spot on. I mean, come on, it's no big deal is it? Let's be nice and share our spaces.

Lisa Nandy .... go to fucking hell

A friend of mine (with no stake in this game) watched the video on which this case is based this afternoon and was as shocked as I was by the disrespect exibited to Lisa Nandy by Julia Long who smirked her way through Ms Nandy's answer without apparently paying any attention to it

I have to marvel at the utter moral vacuity of someone who is more upset about a person smirking than they are about a senior politician endorsing putting a serial rapist in to a women's prison. Perhaps you could pass that on to your friend. What a contemptible human being they must be.

Women, know your limits - stop smiling (when you've shown up the absurdity of a political position).

Also - women: if she's smiling, she's obviously not listening to the answer at the same time. You may be able to multi-task in the kitchen, but when it comes to smiling and listening to politicians at the same time, unlikely combination, according to some!

I'm deleted again! Why is this ok:
Men are offended that we can recognise they aren't women.
And what I said NOT?
Can we really not make a simple statement of FACT without being deleted??
I don't think I can post here any more because I'm just not prepared to lie and I will get deleted and then banned. Been here over a decade. Wow. Thanks HQ.

And the only person I could think of who qualifies as A friend of mine (with no stake in this game) would be a man, who has no daughters, female friends, female partner, mother, aunt, nieces, any interest in the wellbeing of vulnerable women in prison, women's refuges, or in fact any link to/care about children of either sex who may be vulnerable to an ideology that encourages them to think that they could potentially change their sex.

Pretty niche audience to be shocked by Julia smiling/aka 'smirking'.

From 'Lesbian on a Chair' to 'Smirking Julia'.
She's a bad'un.

I'm not sure Julia would feel chastened that Robin and Robin's friend think she is terribly rude. It no doubt would cut her to the heart if she thought that the opinion of those who don't much care about women being raped was at all significant in how she reacts to an elected official saying rapists should be incarcerated with women.

But as she's a clever woman who knows that such deeply immoral people have no authority over her, I suspect she will probably make scornful, rude faces and ignore them.

Use "males" IfNot

If you mean men, you know, men who identify as men, then say "men, who identify as men" just to be very very clear. Them's the rules unfortunately, under (some of) our TRA overlords. Not all TRAALT, of course.

was as shocked as I was by the disrespect exibited to Lisa Nandy by Julia Long who smirked her way through Ms Nandy's answer without apparently paying any attention to it

Thank goodness Julia didn’t tut. That would have been literal violence.

A friend of mine (with no stake in this game) watched the video on which this case is based this afternoon and was as shocked as I was by the disrespect exibited to Lisa Nandy by Julia Long who smirked her way through Ms Nandy's answer without apparently paying any attention to it

I've just showed the video to my DH (who has no stake in this game - other than being invested in the safety of women & girls, as he is married to me, and we have a daughter) and he was as shocked as I was that Lisa Nandy would allow rapists into women's prisons on the basis of self identification.

Men who identify as men- I think I am allowed to say. What if I mean men who identify as women? Can I say that?

You can say "males who identify as women" and remain within the guidelines.

All these people willing to throw women under the bus. The callousness is chilling. And they don't even recognise it! Not Lisa, not Robin, not all of those people lapping up the wokiness.

I still don't really get it, even after years of reading. The arrogance of deciding what the boundaries of other people should be - I thought so much of our society was based on the exact opposite.

I know I'm not grey-rocking yet, but this is for the lurkers.

A common claim on this part of Mumsnet is from transwomen that they've been subject to a 'pile on' from other posters.

Pile-on - imagine if you walked into a forum for car enthusiasts and told them all they should abandon their cars and walk instead. Lots of responses later saying 'no' - would you call that a 'pile-on' or would you recognise you're in a space where their thinking, on the whole, differs from yours?

Robin said I am old enough to have visited aparteid South Africa and have seen a society split into 'Bloks' and 'Blankes'. This poster is appropriating the apartheid fight to fight for the right of male-bodied people to be in female-bodied spaces . Does that sit OK with you?

Robin said Not an acceptable solution especially for someone who had had to fight for their femininity, such as it is.
This poster is fighting for their 'femininity' to be recongised.

Cambridge Dictionary definition of 'femininty':
the fact or quality of having characteristics that are traditionally thought to be typical of or suitable for a woman:
Long hair was traditionally regarded as a sign of femininity.
The flowers and cream lace of the dress indicate femininity and delicacy

Is it that which gives you sacred entry into female-spaces? Fuck that.

No. A rapist {male by very definition of the crime- right now, until the Nandy's of this world change the category} who identifies as female should not be in women's prisons.

Remarkable that Julia knowingly looked at the camera at the specific parts of Nandy's answer that especially underlined her ludicrous position without listening to a word of it. One of those wild coincidences, I suppose.

IfNot I think your first post was probably deleted because, if I remember correctly, you referenced an individual transwoman rather than discussed it in general terms? I didn't see your second post but it can't have been up for long so must have been reported very quickly. Take care.

Oh no! A woman was (debatably) rude, how awful. Has nobody told Julia to be a nice kind woman, like we are supposed to be?

You're right of course, the worst thing a woman could be in this debate is rude, sarcastic or indeed disrespectful. Not inaccurate, incorrect, biased, libelous, misogynistic, myopic, abusive, or downright stupid. The worst trait for a lady to exhibit is disrespect.

I am old enough to have visited aparteid South Africa and have seen a society split into 'Bloks' and 'Blankes'.

And that was an horrific way to treat people, but I bet the areas where people were entitled to privacy and safety within each segregated group, were still split into female and male areas, so your observation brings absolutely nothing to this topic.

And the only person I could think of who qualifies as A friend of mine (with no stake in this game) would be a man, who has no daughters, female friends, female partner, mother, aunt, nieces, any interest in the wellbeing of vulnerable women in prison, women's refuges, or in fact any link to/care about children of either sex who may be vulnerable to an ideology that encourages them to think that they could potentially change their sex.

There we go with those assumptions again.

A natal female, as it happens, from a country where the British GC/Trans debate is regarded as an absurd curiousity.

Oh you're back.

The answer's still no.

A friend of mine (with no stake in this game) watched the video on which this case is based this afternoon and was as shocked as I was by the disrespect exibited to Lisa Nandy by Julia Long who smirked her way through Ms Nandy's answer without apparently paying any attention to it

Holy shit, Julia Long was smirking? How shocking.

To the gulag for her!

Meanwhile, your friend wasn't shocked at Lisa Nandy saying that she thinks that male rapists should go to female prisons if they choose to? Says it all really I guess.

So, I got from Lisa Nandy that all women, in all circumstances, have to give up their single sex spaces in order that it might help with the treatment of a few male persons’ gender dysphoria. Have I got that right?

Proximity to the bodies of women and girls whilst doing intimate things such as sleeping, toileting and being naked - is the prescribed treatment of gender dysphoria - without the consent of said women and girls - obviously.

Exactly the same space won’t help if it is full of men and boys.

bodies of women and girls are being used to help men